secret santa

Don't like to pour cold water on, but I'm not convinced it's an open 3.................

Do they allow visitors to take photos ?

Got 2 B of B 50p coins today in the Cotswolds.

Nice story

Good spot - rare coin. For me the indicator is the wide date with the sea not crossing the linear circle.

When John Jerrams published his coin census in 2003 the populations for dies numbers were die 5 (1), die 3 (3), die 2 (4) and die 4 (6). As you say the die 4's have rocketed since then but I haven't seen too many more die 2 and 3 specimens. I think Bernie has got a good handle on these ?

You're right - corrected it and added the rare penny website.

Thanks Matt - nothing I've done but I've reset it now.

which suggests that it may be a filled die in the wave area.

Interesting - good spot - have we got to check every date from now on...............?

Interesting point that you make Ian regarding the level of interest - maybe the number of collectors of Victorian penny varieties is decreasing. Several collections have been brought to market over the last 10 years and possibly these collectors aren't being replaced with new ones ? I would have thought that as us baby boomers relax into retirement, the numbers might swell but maybe not...........

As well as the excellent photos in the Guide to Grading book, there is a really useful list of descriptions on page 5 where it gives estimates of years that a coin will have been in circulation to be a particular grade. For example, an EF coin will, on average, have been in circulation for about 1 year whereas a Fine coin could have been around for 30 years or so. Your coin would seem to fit the 5 years of circulation that describes VF . By picking coins out of your change, you should be able to get a good feel for wear as there will be decimal coins in your pocket up to 45 years old, and there should be a good range from F to Aunc.

Yes, it's the sort of thing I can add to whenever I get spare time. The concept has worked quite well with the F41 variety. I have received details of an example from a fellow collector (do you have one Jerry ?) and I am already up to 15 pictured examples which matches Gouby's known population, so that figure is beginning to look rather low. I am in 2 minds whether to quote the prices realised for each example - there are pros and cons (not the least being the reduction of the chances of getting a bargain if sellers can see the market !).

I've compiled a gallery of most of the F41 pennies sold in the last 14 years and they're a pretty grim lot, apart from one or two nice ones. See website below, rarepennies

The coin was actually unsold in the auction but I bought it afterwards. Despite its flaws it was the best that Laurie Bamford had managed to get hold of in all his years of collecting and it went for less than it sold for in his sale (in which most coins were reasonably priced in my view). I'd love a better one but I'm not likely to get one.

I've spent quite a bit of time trying to assign pictures to descriptions but am still not sure which is which. High tide and dot are OK - the rest look a bit ambiguous to me. Maybe someone else can post the relationship matrix ?

These are the pics from Laurie Bamford's sale.

Maybe it's just clever lighting.

Yes, I don't know what LCA is doing to their photos but they're managing to convey a very even tone & surface to many of their pennies which can look quite different in daylight or camera flashlight. It's interesting that several people commented that the coins sold in their previous auction looked much better in hand than in their photos, and now the opposite appears to be true.

A changed date I guess because a genuine 1843 has a 3 with a straight top, not a rounded top.

Nice 1843 fake......

Lovely example, Terry.

Prax, do you have that sort of information on other/all rare coins ? It's the sort of thing I was trying to pull together for the rare coin census.

I don't know.

If you could put up a list of the contents (date, denomination, condition) some of the forum members will be able to give you an honest estimate of its worth in advance of your dealing with dealer or auction house. I realise that it may not be practical.