azda, i sincerely hope that you and peckris both understand that my posts were meant in good faith and also meant to differentiate between the bad that occurs on ebay, those you have highlighted as shill bidders, those who clearly sell the utmost of polished crap, designed to mislead, and the genuine dealer, whom may have had a difference in grading to personal levels. we may all disagree on grade of a particular coin at times with bona fida dealers, that happens, we have different ideas and ideals, different knowledge of a specific coin/dies....etc etc, but it sure must be difficult to be all embracing. azda....how many times have you come on here to ask for die pairings/references for a particular penny.....loads azda....how many times have you asked for a grading on a particular coin...................................loads does that make you or any other here better than CC or Rendell........maybe yes, maybe no. but yes it does make YOU and Peckris and CC and Rendell and all the others here far and away better than the those shill bidders, crap sellers on ebay...........and that was the whole point of my original post....... im gonna leave this forum now................theres clearly no place for a prick like me here. ski