Let's See Your Copper Coins, Tokens, Or Medals!

[mrbadexample]

H&S (Heaton & Son) replaces SOHO:

 

[Rob]

11 minutes ago, mrbadexample said:

H&S (Heaton & Son) replaces SOHO:

 

So two questions for me are: 1. is it a penny (based on the position of the middle prong on the trident and the N)? 2. Is the reverse die a copy of the Soho Britannia , or a modified Soho die sold by Taylor to Heaton. As Taylor acquired the tub of dies at the Soho auction following its closure in 1848, the options are it must have come from him after 1860, or undocumented dies must have left Soho before closure, or a second lot of dies was obtained by Heaton at the auction. Given Taylor was also striking tokens for various people, it would be surprising if he passed work on to a competitor, including the supply of dies.

And as an afterthought - is the edge plain?

[mrbadexample]

1. Yes, a penny.

2. As far as I understand it, Annand Smith & Co first issued their copper tokens on October 20th 1849. The original order was from the SOHO mint (SOHO had been removed - picture). Subsequent orders were from Heatons and made from modified dies obtained from the auction of SOHO's bits and pieces.

Sweeney notes: "These tokens involved a reverse die that had been used by Boulton & Watt for Imperial pence back in 1806-7, a die that originally had the SOHO mark of the Boulton mint at the base of the Britannia design below the shield. It was a simple change for Heatons to make (involving an interesting coincidence of letters) to eradicate the SOHO mark and replace it with their own - an H&S for Heaton & Son."

And yes - plain edge.

Edited January 4, 2020 by mrbadexample

[mrbadexample]

A possibility?

[mrbadexample]

[Rob]

That's certainly the catalogue of the sale.

The last looks like the lot of dies purchased by Taylor. The question is whether there was a second tub of dies which were acquired by Heaton which included the 1806 reverse. We know that Taylor acquired dies of virtually every issue recorded by Peck at Soho, but more important is whether these were the only dies in the sale. I don't have the catalogue.

[mrbadexample]

Another bit from Sweeney, after he records the purchases of the presses, says: "Certain additional equipment (engine, shafting and sundry machinery) was thereafter procured from Joseph Taylor, whose firm is known today as Taylor and Challen."

Perhaps he did manage to acquire them from Taylor at some point, if not from the sale.

 

[Garrett]

13 hours ago, ozjohn said:

In many Australian country towns the original business name is still on the building. I do not know if the Rockhampton (Rockie) building still exists but it would be interesting to find out. I doubt if the Brisbane building still exists as there has been much redevelopment over time. This may help. According to tis link the business still exists.

https://collections.museumvictoria.com.au/articles/2474

Yes they do (*edit* at least they've been in the current position for a long-long time.   Early buildings were sometime relocated, even if just slightly.  There are some Rocky historical groups on FaceBook that would be worth joinging if you're keen).

In the below video the Criterion (the 'Cri) is the white building in the middle of the frame at 1:33.

Stewarts is the building behind the post office (with the clock tower) at 2:15 and you can see the name on the building at various times.

 

cheers

 

 

Edited January 4, 2020 by Garrett

[Garrett]

Stewarts probably looked more like this around the time of the token.

still the same corner though I believe (Denham and East).

 

Edited January 4, 2020 by Garrett

[Zo Arms]

An excellent article here about Stewart, Hemmant and the Great fire of Brisbane. Well worth reading all of it. Intriguing last paragraph. ( Hope I've done the link correctly). 

Brisbane Burns: How the Great Fires of 1864 Shaped a City and its People - Sharyn Merkley - Google Books

[Danelaw]

Odd find really. I was emptying some rubbish into a skip..and this was on the floor next to it.

I think some sort of token? Any help out there?

[bagerap]

Swedish occupation money in Latvia (Livonia). If it's real, it is tha best I've ever seen so maybe repro. Originals were in billon

[Paddy]

First side appears to read "Moneta Revalie" and the second "Magistri Livonie". I had a look through Livonia coins on Numista  and came up with this:

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces156067.html

"Modern copy of coin from Livonian order Reval. Tallinn."

[bagerap]

Copy of something like this:

https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=877&lot=6

[Danelaw]

Cheers people. I think you're spot on Paddy!

[Peckris 2]

Yes, it's too good to be anything but a modern repro.

[Danelaw]

Funny though. I started to look at the Swedish takeover of Latvia and the locals quite enjoyed what the Swedes brought to them.

So much so they have a current 10,000 signature protest going on asking them to invade again.😃

 

Not so sure about some of the signer's. Barack Obama has put his weight behind them!

[RLC35]

7 hours ago, Danelaw said:

Funny though. I started to look at the Swedish takeover of Latvia and the locals quite enjoyed what the Swedes brought to them.

So much so they have a current 10,000 signature protest going on asking them to invade again.😃

 

Not so sure about some of the signer's. Barack Obama has put his weight behind them!

 

Who is Barack Obama?

 

[Danelaw]

Try Google.

[Peckris 2]

On 1/19/2020 at 9:39 PM, RLC35 said:

 

Who is Barack Obama?

 

The last person to be President of the United States (I'm not counting Krusty the Clown).

[Paulus]

Upgrade just landed

[JLS]

3 hours ago, Paulus said:

Upgrade just landed

Thomas Paine's printer in London ! I'm rather amazed this hasn't got a US premium attached to it yet. Nice example. 

[blakeyboy]

21 hours ago, Peckris 2 said:

The last person to be President of the United States (I'm not counting Krusty the Clown).

Trump makes Diane Abbott look like Stephen Hawking.

[Paulus]

1 hour ago, JLS said:

Thomas Paine's printer in London ! I'm rather amazed this hasn't got a US premium attached to it yet. Nice example. 

Thanks for that, I didn't know of the connection

 

[JLS]

29 minutes ago, Paulus said:

Thanks for that, I didn't know of the connection

 

The other interesting fact I know about it is that the reverse design tells you where to get it redeemed ! Eaton's publishing house was based at the Cock and Swine, 74 Newgate Street, sadly long demolished. If you're interested in more about Eaton, there's a lot of academic literature which discusses his activities as his friends and clients were basically a who's-who of the radical political scene of 1790s London.

Here's the front page of Eaton's edition of the Rights of Man, for reference, where he's "Citizen Daniel Isaac Eaton, Printer to the Supreme Majesty of the People".