loose54 Posted July 21, 2014 Posted July 21, 2014 What does everybody think about this? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1933-OLD-BRITISH-ONE-PENNY-COIN-/121380829663?pt=UK_Coins_BritishMilled_RL&hash=item1c42dc79df&nma=true&si=HCTIP1LDS82i9wPh3gKl%252Bawq6ic%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557Sold a few days ago for £1550. It had a pretty interesting story line with it (not particularly well written and from a seller with very low feedback). I remember that one of the 1933 pennies known was stolen from under the stone of a church, the same church that this seller is claiming to have found this penny near. It does actually look remarkably like one of the Andre Laurillier proofs to me, maybe there's some substance in it! I tend to see people giving a rough valuation of £50k for a 1933 penny but just personally I think one would make much more then that if found today.However, even if this were the real deal I don't think it would be allowed to be sold. I seem to remember a few years back a lady took a batch of 10 1933 $20 coins to be authenticated and when they were found to be real they were all seized and taken back by the mint as they could only have been gained illegally. Surely that would be the case with this penny (again - IF - it were real) and the buyer would lost out on 1500 quid?What do you guys think? Interesting nonetheless! Quote
Peckris Posted July 21, 2014 Posted July 21, 2014 (edited) First, it does look like the Lavrillier pattern, but those didn't get used when Georgie-boy laid foundation stones, so the 'where' and 'why' of its (alleged) burial doesn't check out.Second, I can't see some 'ordinary Joe' coming into this not knowing what he had; if it was a Mint worker getting it by clandestine methods it wouldn't get buried in a tin.Third, if it does turn out to be genuine (2 chances of that : fat and no) it wouldn't be seized by the Mint or any other authorities - remember, the 1952 halfcrown and Edward VIII brass 3d's weren't legally acquired either, but the Mint had to accept responsibility for lax security and the coins were sold quite legitimately. Possibly one difference between the UK and the US?However, in the unlikely event of its being genuine, somebody got a bargain! But my thought is that the seller made a very fast buck... Edited July 21, 2014 by Peckris Quote
DaveG38 Posted July 21, 2014 Posted July 21, 2014 I don't see any way that those artifacts were contained in a tin laid in the ground. Even the tin itself looks in far too good a condition. Add to that that the coin looks remarkably like the repros being produced a few years ago, and I'd say that the seller (with his feedback of just 8) has gone to a little trouble to 'age' a repro and has thrown in some other materials for good measure to add to his story. What I can't understand is how 27 people could bid it up to £1500 or so, without asking some pretty obvious questions about it, or at the least carrying out a bit of basic research.One look at the rim tells you it's much thicker than the genuine article. Quote
copper123 Posted July 21, 2014 Posted July 21, 2014 Stinks to high heaven as a con trick.The coin would not be a lavrillier pattern if it was a stolen one fro a church - all the pattern coins have good provinances .Someone somewhere has prob done in £1500 in on a poor copy Quote
Nicholas Posted July 22, 2014 Posted July 22, 2014 (edited) There was a lavrillier pattern 1933 Penny sold in Australia thru Noble. Strangely though the image has been removed since I looked at it last time... I was hoping to locate an image of a bona fide example to compare with the eBay example.. http://www.noble.com.au/auctions/lot?id=136691 Edited July 22, 2014 by Nicholas Quote
VickySilver Posted July 22, 2014 Posted July 22, 2014 Lavrilliers look bad enough, this a bad copy of an ugly coin. Five quid maybe (if it looked a bit nicer!). Quote
Bronze & Copper Collector Posted July 22, 2014 Posted July 22, 2014 As P.T. Barnum once said, "There's a sucker born every minute"....We have often seen ample proof of that statement....If it's too good to be true, it isn't! 1 Quote
Rob Posted July 22, 2014 Posted July 22, 2014 There was a lavrillier pattern 1933 Penny sold in Australia thru Noble. Strangely though the image has been removed since I looked at it last time...I was hoping to locate an image of a bona fide example to compare with the eBay example..http://www.noble.com.au/auctions/lot?id=136691That was the Adams coin which then passed to Peter Simon, so in the Alderly collection http://www.colincooke.com/coin_images/alderlypennies/196.jpg Quote
Peckris Posted July 22, 2014 Posted July 22, 2014 one of these methinksInteresting - I've not seen one of those before. It looks remarkably close to the Lavrillier pattern (too close for comfort!), unlike the usual fantasy 1933 repro's, which bear only a slight resemblance to genuine GV issues or patterns. http://www.garyphelps.co.uk/1933%201D%20BU.JPG Quote
Nicholas Posted July 22, 2014 Posted July 22, 2014 There was a lavrillier pattern 1933 Penny sold in Australia thru Noble. Strangely though the image has been removed since I looked at it last time...I was hoping to locate an image of a bona fide example to compare with the eBay example..http://www.noble.com.au/auctions/lot?id=136691That was the Adams coin which then passed to Peter Simon, so in the Alderly collection http://www.colincooke.com/coin_images/alderlypennies/196.jpg Quote
Nicholas Posted July 22, 2014 Posted July 22, 2014 (edited) Rob, you're a genius. That's the coin from the Noble sale that sold for 24KAUD (say £12K in 1994). and you have the provenance.What's its value today? Edited July 22, 2014 by Nicholas Quote
Bronze & Copper Collector Posted July 22, 2014 Posted July 22, 2014 there was one that sold at the ny international show a several years ago too Quote
Coppers Posted July 22, 2014 Posted July 22, 2014 there was one that sold at the ny international show a several years ago tooThis one sold for $29,900 (which included buyer's premium) back in 2009 at a Heritage auction...http://coins.ha.com/itm/great-britain/world-coins/great-britain-george-v-bronze-pattern-penny-by-lavrillier-1933-/a/3004-21452.s Quote
Error Posted December 2, 2014 Posted December 2, 2014 Can someone please enlighten me as to who produced this Lavillier 1933 copy? When compared to the rubbish that Pobjoy makes, this one is really lovely, with proof like fields and crisp definition to the engraving. Quote
Error Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 That's what I thought......but I've only seen web illustrations of (I assume) the genuine article to compare. I only paid 16 quid for this so know it can't be the real thing. Anyone know more about it please? 1 Quote
DaveG38 Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 That's what I thought......but I've only seen web illustrations of (I assume) the genuine article to compare. I only paid 16 quid for this so know it can't be the real thing. Anyone know more about it please?There was a guy in Essex who was knocking out repros of rarities a few years ago. As I recall he produced a 1945 silver threepence, a 1952 halfcrown and a 1954 penny, plus I'm pretty sure a 1933 penny. Whether this is one of his I'm not sure. Quote
Error Posted December 4, 2014 Posted December 4, 2014 OK Dave, thanks. No one else have any clue? Quote
PWA 1967 Posted December 4, 2014 Posted December 4, 2014 Yes its a copy ,they originate from gary phelps Quote
DaveG38 Posted December 4, 2014 Posted December 4, 2014 Yes its a copy ,they originate from gary phelpsThat's the man - well done sir. Quote
Paulus Posted December 4, 2014 Posted December 4, 2014 And he still does copies of the 1933, and others:http://www.garyphelps.co.uk/ Quote
Peckris Posted December 4, 2014 Posted December 4, 2014 And he still does copies of the 1933, and others:http://www.garyphelps.co.uk/Unfortunately, the examples on his website don't look as good as that one Quote
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