Heritage - Eric P Newman Collection

[Coinery]

I've only just got this thread! Finally the penny has dropped!

Edit: sorry, Declan!

Edited February 1, 2014 by Coinery

[Garrett]

Just had a look for some information about the man behind the collection.

Looks like this fellow is one of the greats of our hobby.

Others (beginners) may also be interested in these links,

Wikipedia - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_P._Newman

Gallery of some coins - http://www.ngccoin.com/gallery/newman.aspx

cheers

Garrett.

[jaggy]

Just had a look for some information about the man behind the collection.

Looks like this fellow is one of the greats of our hobby.

Others (beginners) may also be interested in these links,

Wikipedia - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_P._Newman

Gallery of some coins - http://www.ngccoin.com/gallery/newman.aspx

cheers

Garrett.

And the coin I bought is in the gallery

[Accumulator]

Just had a look for some information about the man behind the collection.

Looks like this fellow is one of the greats of our hobby.

Others (beginners) may also be interested in these links,

Wikipedia - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_P._Newman

Gallery of some coins - http://www.ngccoin.com/gallery/newman.aspx

cheers

Garrett.

And the coin I bought is in the gallery

I think all his coins are

[jaggy]

Just had a look for some information about the man behind the collection.

Looks like this fellow is one of the greats of our hobby.

Others (beginners) may also be interested in these links,

Wikipedia - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_P._Newman

Gallery of some coins - http://www.ngccoin.com/gallery/newman.aspx

cheers

Garrett.

And the coin I bought is in the gallery

I think all his coins are

Don't spoil it

[Accumulator]

I've received the following reply from an "International Cataloguer" at Heritage:

The coins were actually stored in those envelopes for the better part of the last several decades. I do not know what MUX stands for. Eric used a variety of different codes for dealers or auction firms from which he purchased the coins, but not all of them are readily apparent nor did he provide us with a breakdown. $4.00 was indeed his original purchase price.

I hadn't realised that what I thought of as an index card is in fact an envelope in which the coin was stored (it hasn't arrived here yet). So we know that "mux" probably represents the seller. I might ask on a US forum as there are bound to be other buyers there, some of whom may have looked into these 'codes'.

[Peckris]

I've received the following reply from an "International Cataloguer" at Heritage:

The coins were actually stored in those envelopes for the better part of the last several decades. I do not know what MUX stands for. Eric used a variety of different codes for dealers or auction firms from which he purchased the coins, but not all of them are readily apparent nor did he provide us with a breakdown. $4.00 was indeed his original purchase price.

I hadn't realised that what I thought of as an index card is in fact an envelope in which the coin was stored (it hasn't arrived here yet). So we know that "mux" probably represents the seller. I might ask on a US forum as there are bound to be other buyers there, some of whom may have looked into these 'codes'.

Perhaps "mux" means the coin was dirty? In which case, have nothing to do with coins marked "dmux"

[Accumulator]

I've managed to talk to a gentleman who is numismatic advisor to the Eric P Newman Education Society and obtained some further interesting information. Also background which may help other purchasers of these coins.

"mux" (as several have suggested) is indeed a cost code used by a St. Louis coin dealer Burdette G Johnson to represent his buy-in price of $1. Eric P Newman paid the stated $4 for the coin, from him.

A large number of EPN's coins apparently came, via Mr Johnson, from the Estate of "Colonel" E H R Green. My coin is not one of these, but the story of these coins, and the records kept, make an interesting read:

B G Johnson's Ledger

"Colonel" E H R Green

It is believed that my coin came from Armin Brand, son of a another noted collector Virgil Brand, but apparently they don't have absolute proof. Proof may lie in these papers held by the American Numismatic Society which are open to consultation. Maybe a task for another day!

[RLC35]

I've managed to talk to a gentleman who is numismatic advisor to the Eric P Newman Education Society and obtained some further interesting information. Also background which may help other purchasers of these coins.

"mux" (as several have suggested) is indeed a cost code used by a St. Louis coin dealer Burdette G Johnson to represent his buy-in price of $1. Eric P Newman paid the stated $4 for the coin, from him.

A large number of EPN's coins apparently came, via Mr Johnson, from the Estate of "Colonel" E H R Green. My coin is not one of these, but the story of these coins, and the records kept, make an interesting read:

B G Johnson's Ledger

"Colonel" E H R Green

It is believed that my coin came from Armin Brand, son of a another noted collector Virgil Brand, but apparently they don't have absolute proof. Proof may lie in these papers held by the American Numismatic Society which are open to consultation. Maybe a task for another day!

Interesting reading Accum...thanks for posting!

[jaggy]

I've managed to talk to a gentleman who is numismatic advisor to the Eric P Newman Education Society and obtained some further interesting information. Also background which may help other purchasers of these coins.

"mux" (as several have suggested) is indeed a cost code used by a St. Louis coin dealer Burdette G Johnson to represent his buy-in price of $1. Eric P Newman paid the stated $4 for the coin, from him.

A large number of EPN's coins apparently came, via Mr Johnson, from the Estate of "Colonel" E H R Green. My coin is not one of these, but the story of these coins, and the records kept, make an interesting read:

B G Johnson's Ledger

"Colonel" E H R Green

It is believed that my coin came from Armin Brand, son of a another noted collector Virgil Brand, but apparently they don't have absolute proof. Proof may lie in these papers held by the American Numismatic Society which are open to consultation. Maybe a task for another day!

Good info. Thanks for the follow up and for sharing with us.

[Accumulator]

Thanks again guys.

Actually I got something slightly wrong, Armin Brand is the brother of Virgil, not his son. Interesting background on their extensive collection (386,000 coins!) and its disposal here.

Anyway, I've written to the ANS and their archivist has been very helpful. She has kindly offered to check their collection of Brand papers and ledgers (referenced above). There may be a small fee if the search is extensive, but I feel it's worth it. I'm beginning to get a glimpse of what Rob and others go through when trying to establish provenance!

Edited February 6, 2014 by Accumulator

[Colin G.]

Thanks again guys.

Actually I got something slightly wrong, Armin Brand is actually the brother of Virgil, not his son. Interesting background on their extensive collection (386,000 coins!) and its disposal here.

Anyway, I've written to the ANS and their archivist has been very helpful. She has kindly offered to check their collection of Brand papers and ledgers (referenced above). There may be a small fee if the search is extensive, but I feel it's worth it. I'm beginning to get a glimpse of what Rob and others go through when trying to establish provenance!

Fascinating stuff, I wonder how deep your pockets would have to be today to gather such a collection

[Rob]

Thanks again guys.

Actually I got something slightly wrong, Armin Brand is actually the brother of Virgil, not his son. Interesting background on their extensive collection (386,000 coins!) and its disposal here.

Anyway, I've written to the ANS and their archivist has been very helpful. She has kindly offered to check their collection of Brand papers and ledgers (referenced above). There may be a small fee if the search is extensive, but I feel it's worth it. I'm beginning to get a glimpse of what Rob and others go through when trying to establish provenance!

Fascinating stuff, I wonder how deep your pockets would have to be today to gather such a collection

I don't know, but I was discussing with my son yesterday how much it would cost to tick all the boxes in my list of desired coins following his recent interest in said collection. Given I aim to maximise diversity and with the caveat that I only collect British coins, this is the same as Brand except that he tried to add anything he didn't possess - worldwide. The 1200 criteria in my case came to an estimated £5m mainly due to the need for a few 'Hobson's Choice pieces such as an Edward III double florin (6/-), Cromwell 50/-, Henry VII sovereign (dragon mark), Edward VI 3rd coinage gold (Ostrich Head mark), Triple Unite (£3), Hywel Dda 1d (unique at present in BM) plus numerous Tudor and Stuart gold pieces etc. Clearly many of these are likely to be 'pie in the sky' pieces unless Mr Lottery pays me a visit. Multiply that 10 or 20 times for the British because he would have multiple dates of the same design, then another 10, 20 or more times for different countries and the number is mind-boggling. A billion? Five billion? Even more amazing is the fact he was adding to the collection in 5 figure quantities every year! How did he have enough hours in the day?

[Rob]

An approximate multiplier is about x1000. Something that cost a quid then is a grand now. So a couple billion is probably in the right ballpark.

[jaggy]

An approximate multiplier is about x1000. Something that cost a quid then is a grand now. So a couple billion is probably in the right ballpark.

I just won $8 on the Powerball so I am moving in the right direction

"To sleep, perchance to dream"

[TomGoodheart]

An approximate multiplier is about x1000. Something that cost a quid then is a grand now. So a couple billion is probably in the right ballpark.

I just won $8 on the Powerball so I am moving in the right direction

"To sleep, perchance to dream"

WooHoo! the coins are on jaggy guys!!!

[Accumulator]

An approximate multiplier is about x1000. Something that cost a quid then is a grand now. So a couple billion is probably in the right ballpark.

I just won $8 on the Powerball so I am moving in the right direction

"To sleep, perchance to dream"

That's a staggering, but I'm sure quite accurate, figure Rob. If Heritage can shift $100 million coins in a single week then it's interesting to speculate that the market would probably be able to absorb the whole collection (had it not already been sold) at today's prices too.

[Coinery]

An approximate multiplier is about x1000. Something that cost a quid then is a grand now. So a couple billion is probably in the right ballpark.

I just won $8 on the Powerball so I am moving in the right direction

"To sleep, perchance to dream"

WooHoo! the coins are on jaggy guys!!!

I'll have a 1967 BU penny then please, Jaggy! Your shout!

[Coinery]

An approximate multiplier is about x1000. Something that cost a quid then is a grand now. So a couple billion is probably in the right ballpark.

I just won $8 on the Powerball so I am moving in the right direction

"To sleep, perchance to dream"

That's a staggering, but I'm sure quite accurate, figure Rob. If Heritage can shift $100 million coins in a single week then it's interesting to speculate that the market would probably be able to absorb the whole collection (had it not already been sold) at today's prices too.

There's no doubt the market is massive! I've just zipped through the BCW sixpences (a cheapish and popular Liz denomination) and calculated, forgetting the rare variety prices, that it would cost around £100,000 to gather up the 'known' varieties in VF! In reality, with the rare dates included, it would be closer to £250,000+ just for something as basic as the sixpences!

[jaggy]

An approximate multiplier is about x1000. Something that cost a quid then is a grand now. So a couple billion is probably in the right ballpark.

I just won $8 on the Powerball so I am moving in the right direction

"To sleep, perchance to dream"

WooHoo! the coins are on jaggy guys!!!

I'll have a 1967 BU penny then please, Jaggy! Your shout!

I will have to look in my penny tin and see what is there