Wanted 1938 Farthing £50

[88tinman]

Im looking for a 1938 farthing CGS 85 i will pay £50 or higher if you can find a 88 / 90

regards Michael

[Peckris]

Im looking for a 1938 farthing CGS 85 i will pay £50 or higher if you can find a 88 / 90

regards Michael

I've no idea what a CGS 85 is - I didn't know there were any farthing varieties for Geo VI. The standard 1938 farthing is worth about £8 - £10 in BU - it's probably the scarcest of that reign. I don't know what you mean by "88 / 90".

[azda]

He means the CGS numbered grading system Peck

[azda]

Im looking for a 1938 farthing CGS 85 i will pay £50 or higher if you can find a 88 / 90

regards Michael

Try Colin Goode at aboutfarthings.com he's also a member of this forum

[Colin G.]

Im looking for a 1938 farthing CGS 85 i will pay £50 or higher if you can find a 88 / 90

regards Michael

Try Colin Goode at aboutfarthings.com he's also a member of this forum

It is a tough date to get in BUNC. The only example I have is the one in my collection, and as tempting as the offer sounds....it took me a fair while to get hold of it!!

Plus I would have to get it slabbed which would mean about a 1-2 month wait.

[Peckris]

He means the CGS numbered grading system Peck

Oh right. I've as much interest in slabs as I have in Graham Norton's girly mag collection.

But £50 for a BU 1938 farthing? Jeez. They're difficult, I will admit that, but they aren't fifty quid difficult!!

[Rob]

I've as much interest in slabs as I have in Graham Norton's girly mag collection.

Should get a healthy premium for the latter - much, much rarer than the slabs.

[88tinman]

Thanks guys , look if i leave my email address michaelpuig@hotmail.co.uk then if anyone does decide to send off a couple of 1938's to get slabbed you can drop me a message i will pay full price 85-£50 88-£75 .... So it could be worth a flutter

Again thanks .. Michael

[Rob]

Thanks guys , look if i leave my email address michaelpuig@hotmail.co.uk then if anyone does decide to send off a couple of 1938's to get slabbed you can drop me a message i will pay full price 85-£50 88-£75 .... So it could be worth a flutter

Again thanks .. Michael

Point taken, but you might have a problem finding people willing to submit coins for slabbing - particularly low value pieces. It's the wrong mindset for most on this forum. Not unreasonably, most take the view of why pay someone for an opinion when they themselves are perfectly capable of assessing a coin's grade. And if you do send it off to CGS in the hope they will slab it with the right number for you and it comes back at less than you are looking for, then they have wasted money. Multiple submissions of cheap coins hoping you will get one back with a high grade label is gambling with the odds stacked quite heavily against you. That's silly. You can get away with recouping costs for lower numbers on more valuable coins, but nobody is going to submit a coin worth a tenner in the hope that it comes back with the right label. In all probability it will still be worth a tenner, even though it has cost you £20 or 30 to get "official approval".

[TomGoodheart]

I'm curious where Michael gets his 'full price's from. Is there a book that lists prices by CGS grading?? That's a new one to me.

And I'm also interested in why a slabbed example is so desirable when, as Rob says, you can assess the grade yourself (or if your name is Dave, get people here to do it for you. )

Edited May 4, 2011 by TomGoodheart

[Colin G.]

I'm curious where Michael gets his 'full price's from. Is there a book that lists prices by CGS grading?? That's a new one to me.

And I'm also interested in why a slabbed example is so desirable when, as Rob says, you can assess the grade yourself (or if your name is Dave, get people here to do it for you. )

Tom,

CGS give a price guide for each denomination/date/variety depending on the grade any coin achieves, and the price guides are viewable by any members on the site, so even if your not convinced by slabbing it's worth joining just to see their price guide I might not always agree with it (no different to any other price guide) but it's another set of figures available for viewing!!

In answer to your second question I think there are multiple potential reasons, but primarily it is a case of people speculating in investment terms ready for slabbing to take off in the UK. If you have the highest graded piece like in the US they suddenly become substanially more desirable/valuable.

And finally don't blast me I am just guessing and trying to put explanations to the post time to hide

[Rob]

Just looked at the finest known section and there isn't a 1938 farthing listed, so God knows if they've actually graded any yet - but if not, I've no intention of being the guinea pig who throws a lot of 1938 farthings at them in the hope of getting back an 88 or a 90. I would suggest that those who desire a slabbed 1938 buy the raw coins and pay for the likely stream of submissions with inadequate grades. Losses should be possible to minimise as it isn't rocket science to grade a coin in most instances, which begs the question why we need to get grading company approval in the first place?

[TomGoodheart]

AFAIK grading services started in the 1980s. I understand that part of the benefit was to reduce the risk of sellers and buyers disagreeing about the grade of a coin.

It seems to me that had this been such a problem then people in the UK would have jumped at the chance to buy certified grade coins but this hasn't been the case. There is still considerable opposition (and I dare say support) for the idea. I'm not convinced that it will really succeed here, largely on the basis that if it was such a brilliant idea it would have taken off rather more strongly by now.

Slabbing Myths

Edited May 5, 2011 by TomGoodheart

[argentumandcoins]

Patio and cake are the only things I can associate with slabs that would be of any use or interest to me, but, each to his own.

[88tinman]

This has all gone very very serious ... all it was my young son who collects farthings mostly wrens, hes only 9 was looking for a nice 38 i thought it would be a nice idea to get him a nice gradded one ... ive checked there website, theres been a total of 5-6 submitted 1938 wrens 2/85's and the rest 82's & 80's and yes theres no gradded one in stock.

Thanks again Michael

[88tinman]

Apology In Advance for using the word "nice" 3 times lol , my grammar is getting worse

[Colin G.]

This has all gone very very serious ... all it was my young son who collects farthings mostly wrens, hes only 9 was looking for a nice 38 i thought it would be a nice idea to get him a nice gradded one ... ive checked there website, theres been a total of 5-6 submitted 1938 wrens 2/85's and the rest 82's & 80's and yes theres no gradded one in stock.

Thanks again Michael

Michael mentioning the word slab with this lot is like prodding them with a hedgehog on a stick!!

Your son has a good eye for the dates, that is without doubt the toughest date to obtain in full lustrous condition. It took me two years to find mine. If I do come across any I will let you know

[Rob]

This has all gone very very serious ... all it was my young son who collects farthings mostly wrens, hes only 9 was looking for a nice 38 i thought it would be a nice idea to get him a nice gradded one ... ive checked there website, theres been a total of 5-6 submitted 1938 wrens 2/85's and the rest 82's & 80's and yes theres no gradded one in stock.

Thanks again Michael

Don't worry Michael, it's not that bad, just that opinion is quite divided on this forum just as with most collectors on the issue of slabs. Americans (the idea originated in the US), are great exponents of the slab, but even there you find a division between the adherents and the heretics. For most it boils down to registry sets, where various collectors are vying for the highest average grade score for the series - hence the desire by some for ever bigger numbers on the slab. This should not be confused with eye appeal as a more attractive coin may well grade lower.

Good to know there are young collectors out there. First reaction to the fact that he is 9 is that a top grade copper coin is probably safer in a slab than in the hands of a 9 year old because it is all too easy to put finger or thumbprints on full lustre coins and there is no way to get rid of them. The issue of protection is the main benefit of them in most eyes around here. At least he has started with a nice easy series to collect with no real rarities in the currency pieces and they are cheap to acquire, so upgrading whether in a slab or not wouldn't be prohibitively expensive.

Edited May 6, 2011 by Rob

[Peter]

This has all gone very very serious ... all it was my young son who collects farthings mostly wrens, hes only 9 was looking for a nice 38 i thought it would be a nice idea to get him a nice gradded one ... ive checked there website, theres been a total of 5-6 submitted 1938 wrens 2/85's and the rest 82's & 80's and yes theres no gradded one in stock.

Thanks again Michael

Hi Michael

Colin Cooke has an UNC lustre 38 for £2.

[azda]

Myth number 6 may interest you and other bronze collectors

MYTH NO. 6: A coin can't deteriorate once it is

encapsulated in a slab.

On the contrary, the deterioration of coins--even when

housed in slabs--is a source of growing concern and

represents a problem that's likely to occupy us increasingly

over the next several years.

NGC conducted some very intriguing age-acceleration

simulations in which coins that were sonically sealed in

tamper-resistant holders had their age accelerated by

decades. The results proved unsatisfactory, at least in terms

of copper coins: The coins actually deteriorated while they

were in the holders. I have seen a number of copper coins in

PCGS holders which actually broke out in spots while in the

holders.

There's really no way that a coin can be completely

protected against environmental variables, whether it's in a

slab or otherwise. We have seen a number of cases where

moisture in the air permeated the holders, as well as other

cases where coins made of highly susceptible and vulnerable

metals such as copper were, in a sense, choking in their

holders--trapped inside with airborne particulate matter

which was causing the coins to deteriorate.

Because copper coins are so susceptible to damage and

deterioration, NGC does not guarantee the grades it assigns

to them, as it does with coins produced in other metals. PCGS

does guarantee the grades of copper coins--but I have seen no

difference in the way these coins deteriorate while

encapsulated, whether the holders came from one service or

the other.

This is a real problem, one I sense we'll have to

address more urgently over the next several years as coins

that are susceptible grow older in holders and their

deterioration becomes more apparent.

[Rob]

Myth number 6 may interest you and other bronze collectors

MYTH NO. 6: A coin can't deteriorate once it is

encapsulated in a slab.

On the contrary, the deterioration of coins--even when

housed in slabs--is a source of growing concern and

represents a problem that's likely to occupy us increasingly

over the next several years.

NGC conducted some very intriguing age-acceleration

simulations in which coins that were sonically sealed in

tamper-resistant holders had their age accelerated by

decades. The results proved unsatisfactory, at least in terms

of copper coins: The coins actually deteriorated while they

were in the holders. I have seen a number of copper coins in

PCGS holders which actually broke out in spots while in the

holders.

There's really no way that a coin can be completely

protected against environmental variables, whether it's in a

slab or otherwise. We have seen a number of cases where

moisture in the air permeated the holders, as well as other

cases where coins made of highly susceptible and vulnerable

metals such as copper were, in a sense, choking in their

holders--trapped inside with airborne particulate matter

which was causing the coins to deteriorate.

Because copper coins are so susceptible to damage and

deterioration, NGC does not guarantee the grades it assigns

to them, as it does with coins produced in other metals. PCGS

does guarantee the grades of copper coins--but I have seen no

difference in the way these coins deteriorate while

encapsulated, whether the holders came from one service or

the other.

This is a real problem, one I sense we'll have to

address more urgently over the next several years as coins

that are susceptible grow older in holders and their

deterioration becomes more apparent.

None of the copper coins in slabs bought for myself have come out in spots. The slabs have a problem though - they tend to crack and split and come apart into a few pieces.

[Cerbera100]

None of the copper coins in slabs bought for myself have come out in spots. The slabs have a problem though - they tend to crack and split and come apart into a few pieces.

Says Rob quickly hiding the hammer and chisel!

Personally, I prefer a hacksaw around the seal... less splintery bits!

[VickySilver]

I believe PCGS has rescinded their warranty on copper within their slabs..

[Rob]

None of the copper coins in slabs bought for myself have come out in spots. The slabs have a problem though - they tend to crack and split and come apart into a few pieces.

Says Rob quickly hiding the hammer and chisel!

Personally, I prefer a hacksaw around the seal... less splintery bits!

No hammer and chisel for me - this is the tool of choice. It nibbles away the seal around the edge. The only one it has difficulty with is the early fat NGC holder. CGS come apart like a dream, followed by PCGS, then NGC in order of ease.

Edited May 9, 2011 by Rob

[Red Riley]

No hammer and chisel for me - this is the tool of choice. It nibbles away the seal around the edge. The only one it has difficulty with is the early fat NGC holder. CGS come apart like a dream, followed by PCGS, then NGC in order of ease.

I think it's called a 'tile nibbler'. Get it for a couple of quid or so from any tile shop, B & Q etc.

Edited May 10, 2011 by Red Riley