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Mike is right they do occasionally show up. I have bought an F24, F27 and F32 on ebay in the past 5 years.... only 1 of these was spotted by other bidders... so the total for all three was only around £500.....bargains can still be found, although it is increasingly difficult with so many people now playing the game

Hey, I might have bid a little more if it had looked that good Terry!!

F24 with missing top leaf sold in group on ebay last night, cropped pictures for Richard's site unless another member won it and can do better ones.

One of the more interesting dot pennies I think is the 1853 Obverse with a small dot between the I and A of GRATIA. This exact same 'italic 5' obverse has been found paired with both a Plain Trident and an Ornamental Trident reverse. Think has been discussed a couple of times before on the forum, for example Page 18 of 'Penny Acquisition of the week'.....scrolling down past half way

Round dot with die crack.....but which was there first?

Really nice coin Paddy, but I'm not sure the N/Z is considered rare enough for Richard's rarestpennies website. Wasn't mentioned in the cointalk thread but the N/Z reverse is actually seen paired with two different obverse dies.....been discussed on the forum before on Page 61 'More Pennies'

Don't know if a member grabbed the 1862 penny with HP numerals on Sunday evening, which sold in a group of 9 for £143.04. Poor grade, but date very clear. I have cropped the ebay pictures in case Richard wishes to add to his site.

Hey, I've just realised I've moved up from being a Junior Member into a 'Regular'...…..things are looking up today.

£3.75 inc. postage from (it's not easy being) a dealer...…………...should I feel guilty? 🧐

No worries Richard, here is LC WYON just to confirm

I thought it was an F38 Richard

Please feel free to add pictures to rarestpennies if you wish Richard

Why risk posting coins worth £580 for 61p uninsured postage? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/penny-hot-oferts/123979683837?hash=item1cddc3d7fd:g:qycAAOSwAPpdv9Re

Clearly the same coin Bernie

I haven't listed many coins on ebay in the past year, because I sensed that buyers are not achieving good results nowadays, and that I may be underwhelmed..the same as Rob. I did, however, decide to put a half decent group of Victorian pennies (copper and bronze), on ebay last Thursday, finishing next Sunday. I reckon a couple of years ago there would have been far more interest / bidding by now. I may decide this is the last time I will use ebay for decent grade coins if I can't even recoup my money on this group. I will wait and see what happens with interest...…...and the next holiday in mind lol 😎

Similarly, clashing on some Victorian Young Head pennies resulted in what some collectors thought was a deliberate tie ribbon

Got a feeling that Jack Relph picked those up at Stroud Auctions (5/12/18) and that they were part of Alan Stevenson's collection. He lived in Cirencester and used to buy a lot on ebay with user name bargains1* before he passed away in June 2018...……....….but I may be wrong.

A nice example of large re-cut rose with small date obverse Pete, not sure I have seen one better than that!

Not trying to tell everyone what to collect, just my own thoughts!

….so for example these would be the date 'font' differences you would seek for your 1851 collection, instead of the numerous date width variations.

I think you have ‘hit the nail on the head’ with this comment Richard. If I was ever to attempt to re-categorise the Young Head penny series I think I would steer away from using date widths, and as far as date varieties are concerned would concentrate instead on the different numeral font types. If date widths are used then where do you draw the line in your collection, because ‘in my experience’ every die has numerals in slightly different positions? Using the above Long numeral 7 as an example, which only represents less than 10% of the entire 1857 population, I have found 5 different obverse dies, all with slightly different positions for the 57. In fact without the use of a digital microscope you would be hard pushed to know they were all struck from different dies………….fortunately they all have die flaws in different locations which makes life easier.

There is additionally a type of 1859 date style which is not currently recorded on Gouby's website. It has the same style numeral 5 as the small date (Gouby B, your right picture), but has yet another (3rd) font type for the numeral 9. I sometimes refer to this as the 1859 'Narrow' Date style, for what it's worth! My experience is that both these 'small' and 'narrow' date varieties have been struck from single die pairings, so only one date width is ever found for each of these two numeral types. This is not true of the larger numeral type of 1859 (Gouby A's) where so far I have recorded 6 different date types. Note that whilst the obverse of the 'Small Date' is clearly different from the 'Narrow Date' this is not true of the reverse dies for these two types, which have the same die flaws!! In my opinion the 'Small Date' obverse was first paired with this reverse die, and then the same reverse die was subsequently used with the 'Narrow Date' obverse...………...with these reverse flaws becoming even more extended, but commencing in the same locations!!

….and pictures (140x) showing height of small 5 and large 5 for coins in top and bottom picture above

The different styles of 5 in my experience is a consistent method of distinguishing between 1858 Small Date numerals (Gouby C and Gouby E) and the Large Date numerals found on all other date styles recorded by Gouby. In my opinion it is better to think of this difference rather than looking at date widths as there are many minor variations of date widths found on both the small 5 and large 5 numeral font types...………... the attached picture (same magnification on each image) illustrates.

The example which appeared on ebay a year or so ago was the same piece that was sold in the LCA December 2016 auction. I tracked down this ebayer and he said he made a mistake by putting a picture of the 1870 dot from his reference folder onto ebay, instead of the actual coin he had for sale! So that means 4 known so far, not 5