TomGoodheart

One primarily for the hammered fans, but I suspect most here will see the appeal of this little coin. A pattern Edward VI shilling. Very nice. Very rare. Very expensive! Just goes to show that hammered doesn't always mean bashed about or knackered! And a link to the site for those interested in further details: Roderick Richardson

Hi and welcome. As everyone else has said, coin collecting and buying bullion are two very different things. If you want bullion, buy ingots because generally bullion 'coins' like Britannias are marked up quite a bit above bullion (scrap) price. Plus there's the old 'don't buy at the top of the market' thing. Anyone buying metal now is going to be paying well above what the smart investors paid a year or two ago and while you might get your money back .. well, there's a risk you won't. Coins however are generally collected for reasons apart from the value of the metal they are made from. People like the artistry, history, or challenge of forming a collection and the intrinsic value of the coin is of little interest. Take the coin below. Scrap value for the silver? £2.62. But the value to me as part of a collection of 17th century coins? Rather more!

Does that mean I can offset all my losses against purchases? WooHoo! More money from the gummint! Or ... maybe not. I have always assumed that money I make from selling a coin (imaginary though that might be) counts as a capital gain. And as I'm preeeeeety sure that my gains for this tax year are under £10,600, I'm hoping I don't need to worry. And there's also the fact that HMRC haven't sent me a message yet .. I wonder if there's a particular category of seller on ebay that gets them? Or it might just be that I never log off ... so never log in again!

I think ebay has it's uses. For a buyer it has the huge advantage over auctions in that you don't have the buyer's premium. And if you want to avoid paypal there are still cheques for the UK. There's also the thing that for sellers an unusual item can be buried amongst other stuff at auction, whereas with ebay you can to a degree tailor your listing to your potential buyers. It's the old thing. There are bargains to be had all over the place. But to benefit from ebay you need to know your coins, ask the right questions and reassure yourself. If you have the budget to take a gamble, that's up to you, it can pay off. Or not. The major problem with ebay is that as well as a huge market place it is also an ideal place for sellers with no knowledge of what they are selling (and invariably overinflated opinions. Go on a detectorist site and 9 times out of 10 when discussing a hammered coin people identify the type or mint mark as one of the rarest rather than looking for the simplest and commonest answer) with people who similarly have little knowledge about what they are buying. Hence the market for what are, basically, ruined coins. Of course, as a counterpoint, I was looking through an auction catalogue from about 10 years ago and to me many of the coins I was interested in looked dipped and a few others appeared to have tell-tale scratches suggesting cleaning. Not horrendous, but none of the mix of toning you'd expect from a collection built up over 20 years or so. There was no mention of this in the catalogue and the coins, obviously, sold. Maybe buyers are more tolerant of such things than I thought ...?

Since the thread is now half about grading, I shall chip in again. With hammered my personal feeling is that the market average (ie across the bulk of dealers) grading has become less demanding. The problem of course is that the definitions are quite vague. Spink's little book says for a coin to be VF "design and legends still clear but with slight evidence of wear and/or minor damage". What is 'slight' or 'minor'? I have seem quite a few 'VF' or even 'gVF' coins over the last year or two that I would class as "showing quite a lot of wear but with design and legends distinguishable" which to my eyes makes the coin only Fine. I don't want the thread to become about knocking individual dealers and their grading, so I'm not going to provide specific examples. But the point is that quite a few of todays dealers still belong to that generation that worked for Spink, Baldwins, DNW and the like and I do not believe that how some of them grade a coin today would be as critical of its flaws as they would have been 20 years ago. Now I'm not claiming to be an expert at grading. In fact I don't worry about grade at all really, it's just do I like the coin, will it seem disappointing next to my other coins, or is it an improvement on my current one. I'm simply noticing that more often I look at a coin and read the grade given and think " ... er, really?" Which I suppose is jut me knocking on again about the key things in collecting being learning about your subject, knowing your market and making your own decisions as to value for money.

Cool, but I think ovelapping the images confuses things a bit. I think the James I shilling you have on ebay (is that you?) makes a good striking image to start a section, but when discussing the marks themselves, I'd rather have them apart, though I like the idea of having the coin the image comes from there too. And the 'plaque' with text doesn't do it for me. I think I'd stick to text alone .. and not italics. That way the text more closely resembles the legend lettering. But I wouldn't worry too much about that aspect. Stick to one font, similar to the one you have.

Meh. When I buy on ebay whether it's for a couple of quid or hundred, it'll be a coin I want and I fugure, why take the risk? So even if signed for insured post isn't offered I ask for it and have never had anyone refuse. When selling I use minimum recorded delivery. While I think the vast majority of folk on ebay are honest, why take the risk I think? Just out of interest, do bidders know when they have been blocked?

Sometimes you base metal guys are so difficult to entertain ....

Result! We had grand plans for one property (we rent out two), it needs new units in the double glazed windows, generally redecorating and we'd thought of replacing the kitchen work surfaces, which were a bit knackered even when we bought the place. But the agent had a tennant who was happy to move in as it was, who has now redecorated it herself and we've had one (or knowing us, and how long we take to do things, two) months' more rent which, even if we'd upped the price a bit after redecorating, would have taken a couple of years to recoup. I'd recommend letting as soon as you have reliable interest in the place.

Hmmm ... I do rather feel that grading standards have slipped over the years. Not necessarily in an attempt to trick buyers, since there are a few well known dealers whose grades I have wondered about. Perhaps just a general .. laxity? I think there are some such as Brian Dawson and Colin Cooke (who I can name as they aren't here) who would do a double take at some current dealers' grades. And as to ebay, well ... I wonder if it's not a generation thing? Many of the .. ahem .. senior .. dealers used to work for Spink, Baldwins and so on and learnt their grading from 1960s standards. Younger dealers don't all have that experience. Now clearly there are some who still grade conservatively, such as Chris here. And there are still a few who if you ask will explain how they came to their decision. But many I think are .. a little generous. But hopefully not gF to EF generous! Now if all coins were like hammered where the degree of wear is not always the ultimate decider of desirability, it wouldn't matter much. But where price is directly linked to grade, such as in the US, there's a risk of the inexperienced (at least) losing out when they come to sell their so-called EF beauties.

Looking through, all the Bedale coins I have records for seem to have been quite bright and in decent condition. My only hoard coins (to my knowledge) come from Prestbury (2005) and sadly all look as if they have been swilled around in a bucket of sand, with fine surface scratches! None had that crispness of the Bedale coins either. Shame really.

The pound coins produced at Oxford during the civil war are 120g, twice the weight of a cartwheel twopence and in diameter go up to 52mm. http://www.petitioncrown.com/CHARLES_I_OXFORD_MINT.html While it might be nice to have one, it wouldn't be very handy for day to day use!

And, no. I was just browsing and saw it, thought it looked pretty and that someone here might be interested if the price was right, which is why I asked about how much. I know you guys get all excited about halfpennies and such. The asking price is a bit over £36 The reverse:

Does this date look a bit odd? And more importantly, how much is it worth ?

Don't clean them or do anything else. Take the best condition and maybe oldest and post photos of them here. That will give us an idea about how old and what condition. After that maybe people can list a few dates to look out for. However if they are just in a tin, don't expect any exciting rarities I'm afraid. Most coins, even very, very old ones have been bashed around so much through wear they really aren't worth much more than .. well, pennies, really. They might make an interesting study, if you are into that sort of thing. But if you just want the value, probably people can offer better advice once we know what sort of coins you have.

To be honest ciandon, videos aren't the ideal way to view objects that are static and could just as easily be shown (usually in far sharper detail) in a photograph. How about taking some pics with a normal camera and posting them?

A photo of the electrotype Stuart shillings would be of interest, if you have one?

Spink 2791, Sharp E3/2. Unfortunately, I have one of that type already. Though thank you for the offer!

Any Charles I shillings you want IDing DL? (hint!)

POIDH Pidh? i mean't cleaning Pictures Or It Didn't Happen, ie, where are the photos Patrick?! Never thought I'd have to teach a youngster internet slang!

Just remember, mine was the first identified 'small ridge number' 10p, so I shall be asking an appropriately inflated price for it. Oh, never mind. The wife just spent it.

OK, I got bored. On my 2008 10 pence piece there are 90 ridges (the bits that stick out). However, putting it against a 1992 10p piece shows that the ridges do not all line up and so I conclude they are different. And setting logic aside, I suspect that it depends on what year or which machine is used and that there is no consistent number of millings. I do not have the patience to compare and count any more of the things however, so I'm afraid Curiousity you'll have to make do with that!

Surely there's a trades description breach here? pris·tine/ˈprisˌtēn/ Adjective: 1.In its original condition; unspoiled. 2.Clean and fresh as if new; spotless. I don't think it qualifies as either. It's just plain nasty.

I didn't realise peeing was an Olympic sport now, but little surprises me these days. And talking of surprises, I had thought you were all Home Counties chaps. Now I know why I never bumped into any of you when I was up at my club.

If you can get a photo that makes the most of the bust, I'd say maybe £40?