1983 2 Pence Mule

[2pornot2p]

Hi, I'm a new member to the forum, with a pretty comprehensive collection of modern (1860 onwards) coins, most of which are well referenced and catalogued.

The one modern coin that I have which fascinates me is the 1983 2 pence mule.

There seems to be considerable snobbery associated with it. Yet I have yet to find someone who admits to owning one. I have no wish to enter the debate upon the value. It strikes me that this coin, which is universally recognised as the only true decimal issue rarity, has drawn so much derision.

Whatever the merit attached to the design of all UK decimal coins, they are undeniably Coins of the Realm, and will always remain so.

Of course no one will ever honestly know how many escaped The Mint, clearly there weren't many, Judging by the amount of publicity relating to it over the years, one would surely have seen more than the few that have publicly been revealed. The only 'serious' attempt to assess how many exist was one of statistical probability.

My opinion; IT IS RARE. Irrespective of its aesthetic credibility, it will always have numismatic value because it exists.

Therefore it will always be of value to someone!

[Peckris]

Hi, I'm a new member to the forum, with a pretty comprehensive collection of modern (1860 onwards) coins, most of which are well referenced and catalogued.

The one modern coin that I have which fascinates me is the 1983 2 pence mule.

There seems to be considerable snobbery associated with it. Yet I have yet to find someone who admits to owning one. I have no wish to enter the debate upon the value. It strikes me that this coin, which is universally recognised as the only true decimal issue rarity, has drawn so much derision.

Whatever the merit attached to the design of all UK decimal coins, they are undeniably Coins of the Realm, and will always remain so.

Of course no one will ever honestly know how many escaped The Mint, clearly there weren't many, Judging by the amount of publicity relating to it over the years, one would surely have seen more than the few that have publicly been revealed. The only 'serious' attempt to assess how many exist was one of statistical probability.

My opinion; IT IS RARE. Irrespective of its aesthetic credibility, it will always have numismatic value because it exists.

Therefore it will always be of value to someone!

Yes, I agree with you. I don't really collect decimals myself (apart from a representative collection of proof sets and BU sets), but there's no arguing that that 1983 2p is THE major modern rarity, unless the aquatics 50p rivals it for numbers. So you won't find snobbery here about it.

Having said that, if you asked me if I'd rather have the 1983 2p or a really high grade William III halfcrown, I'd go with the halfcrown every time

[Paulus]

Hi, I'm a new member to the forum, with a pretty comprehensive collection of modern (1860 onwards) coins, most of which are well referenced and catalogued.

The one modern coin that I have which fascinates me is the 1983 2 pence mule.

There seems to be considerable snobbery associated with it. Yet I have yet to find someone who admits to owning one. I have no wish to enter the debate upon the value. It strikes me that this coin, which is universally recognised as the only true decimal issue rarity, has drawn so much derision.

Whatever the merit attached to the design of all UK decimal coins, they are undeniably Coins of the Realm, and will always remain so.

Of course no one will ever honestly know how many escaped The Mint, clearly there weren't many, Judging by the amount of publicity relating to it over the years, one would surely have seen more than the few that have publicly been revealed. The only 'serious' attempt to assess how many exist was one of statistical probability.

My opinion; IT IS RARE. Irrespective of its aesthetic credibility, it will always have numismatic value because it exists.

Therefore it will always be of value to someone!

Yes, I agree with you. I don't really collect decimals myself (apart from a representative collection of proof sets and BU sets), but there's no arguing that that 1983 2p is THE major modern rarity, unless the aquatics 50p rivals it for numbers. So you won't find snobbery here about it.

Having said that, if you asked me if I'd rather have the 1983 2p or a really high grade William III halfcrown, I'd go with the halfcrown every time

No contest for me neither, just a no-brainer!

[Rob]

What snobbery is associated with the 1983 mule? It's just another thing to collect if decimals, bronze, errors or RM sets is your chosen area.

[Nordle11]

By the way OP, I enjoyed your username...made me chuckle

[Nordle11]

Currently £750 at the time of posting.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ultra-Rare-1983-2p-New-Pence-Royal-Mint-Mule-Error-RARE-/151251289184?pt=UK_Coins_OtherBritish_RL&hash=item2337478460

Although the first line in the description is quite annoying. If you want a reserve on it....PUT A BLOODY RESERVE ON IT!!

[just.me]

Seems a bit suspect, this set was also 'sold' back in February and last week and is now on again? The original sale stated that the coin had been taken out and put back in.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ultra-Rare-1983-2p-New-Pence-Royal-Mint-Mule-Error-No-Rush-For-Payment-/151219637478?pt=UK_Coins_OtherBritish_RL&hash=item2335648ce6&nma=true&si=WYI%252BBnYHSeo7A2fyYwvGtmtJlwo%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1983-2p-New-Pence-Royal-Mint-Mule-Error-EXTREMELY-RARE-/161236773046?pt=UK_Coins_BritishDecimal_RL&hash=item258a75e8b6&nma=true&si=WYI%252BBnYHSeo7A2fyYwvGtmtJlwo%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

[Nordle11]

Seems a bit suspect, this set was also 'sold' back in February and last week and is now on again? The original sale stated that the coin had been taken out and put back in.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ultra-Rare-1983-2p-New-Pence-Royal-Mint-Mule-Error-No-Rush-For-Payment-/151219637478?pt=UK_Coins_OtherBritish_RL&hash=item2335648ce6&nma=true&si=WYI%252BBnYHSeo7A2fyYwvGtmtJlwo%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1983-2p-New-Pence-Royal-Mint-Mule-Error-EXTREMELY-RARE-/161236773046?pt=UK_Coins_BritishDecimal_RL&hash=item258a75e8b6&nma=true&si=WYI%252BBnYHSeo7A2fyYwvGtmtJlwo%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

What makes that suspect? Surely it makes more sense that it's cropped again after being sold recently.

[Rob]

Seems a bit suspect, this set was also 'sold' back in February and last week and is now on again? The original sale stated that the coin had been taken out and put back in.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ultra-Rare-1983-2p-New-Pence-Royal-Mint-Mule-Error-No-Rush-For-Payment-/151219637478?pt=UK_Coins_OtherBritish_RL&hash=item2335648ce6&nma=true&si=WYI%252BBnYHSeo7A2fyYwvGtmtJlwo%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1983-2p-New-Pence-Royal-Mint-Mule-Error-EXTREMELY-RARE-/161236773046?pt=UK_Coins_BritishDecimal_RL&hash=item258a75e8b6&nma=true&si=WYI%252BBnYHSeo7A2fyYwvGtmtJlwo%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

The two previous sales show 3 small brighter marks before the N, up from the tail of the 2 and before the C. That isn't seen on the latest listing. If taken out and replaced, what's to say it isn't a mule of the wrong sort i.e. a 1983 obverse milled out and a NEW PENCE reverse dropped in (or vice-versa)? I notice that no feedback was left for either of the two previous listings.

Edited March 11, 2014 by Rob

[just.me]

Maybe it is right enough, he has actually stated that someone pinched his photos and that he had a non paying bidder and has re-listed.

The toning of the just the Twopence seems strange to me and why it would have been removed and replaced back into the set. There also seems to be a flaw on the reverse rim above the E in pencE.

I like the idea of milling a standard 1983 out and dropping in an older reverse. I have a few Victorian and Edward Pennies that have been milled out, but nothing been put in. I've also seen a large 10pence double tailed that was done this way, easily spotted under a loupe but very difficult to spot with the naked eye.

[bronze mad]

The decimal coinage in years to come will be what newcomers will collect. Especially when we get a new monarch on the throne.

And this will raise prices through demand. And im sure then more people will study them and more rarities will arise.

[Chris Perkins]

It was 'sold' for £790 this time round, but in a flash is now re-listed as apparently the winner had no money.

Odd. I've never actually had that problem as a seller, but it does seem to be very widespread that people with no money will keep bidding on things.

I don't like the pics either, and if this was the only one available in the world, I still wouldn't go anywhere near it.

[Rob]

It was 'sold' for £790 this time round, but in a flash is now re-listed as apparently the winner had no money.

Odd. I've never actually had that problem as a seller, but it does seem to be very widespread that people with no money will keep bidding on things.

I don't like the pics either, and if this was the only one available in the world, I still wouldn't go anywhere near it.

Ended, relisted and now ended again on the grounds there was an error in the listing........... like it was dodgy?

[BigJohnny]

Hi all - first time post and only being collecting a few months.

 

I have the 1983 Martini collector set with the rare 2p mule.  Does anyone know the best place to get it authenticated?  It is still factory sealed and doesn't seem to have been tampered with but I would just like to get an experts decision on its true authenticity. I attempted to upload pictures but error message says only .49MB allowed.  I can email pictures.

 

Any help is greatly appreciated.  Regards  john

[BigJohnny]

1 minute ago, BigJohnny said:

Hi all - first time post and only being collecting a few months.

 

I have the 1983 Martini collector set with the rare 2p mule.  Does anyone know the best place to get it authenticated?  It is still factory sealed and doesn't seem to have been tampered with but I would just like to get an experts decision on its true authenticity. I attempted to upload pictures but error message says only .49MB allowed.  I can email pictures. 

 

Any help is greatly appreciated.  Regards  john

also would getting it slabbed make it a better investment or just keep it safe in its original presentation folder?

[Rob]

Why would you get it slabbed? Unless you have a suspicion that it isn't genuine, authentication is not necessary, and in any case the TPGs don't get it right all of the time. If you really want it authenticated then send it to the Royal Mint. Slabbing may or may not improve its value. I suspect that with 2p pieces not often collected, the fact that it is in the original packing would help. Personally, I wouldn't break it out.

[Nordle11]

I'd agree with Rob, it being sealed inside the pack will be much better than it being slabbed. Send it to the RM.

[Nutsaboutcoins]

Welcome Johnny,

This is a sought after coin and as it only occurred in sets, both the Martini and Heinz, I think most collectors would prefer to purchase the set rather than an odd coin.

Ian..

[Guest Bigjohnny]

Thanks, got two now.

[Chris Perkins]

Selling either of them BigJohnny?

[jacinbox]

There was one on ebay for 800 quid a few days back.