Gary

by the way, although the reverse of this coin also has the break in the linear circle this is not an indicator that the Obv is the R over B variety. I have found others that have the break where the Obv. is normal.

and the whole coin,

Another one has turned up. This one is in much better condition, my grade nEF with lustre. The overstrike is slightly different (see scan). The one on the right is the original one and on the left, the new find.

Thanks for the info Chris but how do I go about getting a copy, do you know?

Hi Rob, I have, at last, had a good look and can see no signs of another double letter except the F of F:D but that is correctly aligned i.e directly on top of the lower F. I have compared this coin to another F 282 and it seems that the whole of BRITT has been re-engraved or re-punched slightly further away from the linear circle. Although the underlying T is too close to the linear circle to be normal. A x10 Mag was used.

I have just come into possession of the short haired variety. Although not brilliant, I think it does show the differences quite well, especially the thin wrist and the double incuse lines on the shield. More of the linear circle is missing on my example, a gap from just before the P up to the center between E and N of Penny. Could someone please send the the E-Mail address for Mal Lewendon or ask him to contact me as I too would be very interested in his CD. I believe I had contact with him several years back but no longer have his E-Mail address. thanks.

Ok, 2 Rentenmark from 1937 is quite commen, value for a crisp clean note straight from the bank would be around 40 quid for one with a seven figure serial number. If it has an 8 figure serial number then in the condition that yours is in then it is almost worthless, sorry. 1 Rentenmark also from 1937, here the same applies as for the 2 Rentenmark. The other 2 german ones look to be 50 Mark notes from 1919, again these are quite commen and the value would be around 10 to 20 quid for crisp new notes. Again yours are no where near "as issued" so unfortunatly very little value. As for the russian one, no idea but I also have one and I would presume that they are also fairly worthless in this condition. With banknotes, stamps and also coins, it is the condition that counts unless they are extremly rare. Hope you are not too dissapointed.

Chris, have you not put this topic under the wrong heading? There is a category for Coin Collecting Software, surely this topic should be under this heading?

That is interesting. What time frame are we talking about here Chris? Do you know when the next version is due? Do you know if they are planning a purely British version with British grading built in? good, VG, nF, F, gF, nVF, VF etc. If they are planning to add Peck & Freeman Numbers are they also considering ESC numbers for Silver coins? Do you have your fingers in every pie? (no answer required ) I was thinking of ordering the Coinmange 2005 but I think I will now wait a while to see what they come up with! Thanks for the info Chris. Have a good weekend.

I have a 1902 Crown in nEF if anyone is interested. If you are interested then contact me and I will send larger Photos via E-Mail. I am looking for around 50 Pounds, make me an offer!

Hi Rob reference your scanning problem- get a good digital Camera, its quicker and the colour is true. There is another tread on this forum about digital photography of coins, I am sure you have read it.

I have had a quick play with this program. My first impression is not too good. Yes, you can start a collection named "GB" and create folders for the various denominations but when you try to enter a coin in say, the Farthing folder, you cannot change the heading of the first two columns and you cannot delete them. These columns are headed "ITEM" and "Quantity". I would prefer not to have these two columns and start of with the Year. If you leave these columns blank you cannot continue and if you make an entry under "ITEM" you cannot use that entry again as the program will not accept multiple items with the same name. Chris, have you worked around this somehow? I have also downloaded Liberty Streets trial program and find that much easier to use, although someone who has not used it before could find it daunting. A negative is the american grading system but you can deactivate this and type in the grades manually. The Data bank is quite good but being a collector of bronze and copper coins I would have to modify it to include Peck and Freeman numbers by hand. Collection Explorer costs $39 and Liberty St. Coinmanage 2005 $42 At the moment my vote goes to Liberty St. and I would be willing to pay the extra $3, but I am still playing

Hi Louise, small correction, it is a Bronze Penny and not copper. The 1860 Copper penny is bigger, 34mm in diameter and would be worth many times that of the Bronze 1860 penny. This is a copper Penny, they were minted from 1825 - 1860

I agree with custard1966, a gVF. looks very nice.

This die flaw is commen on all penny coins with Freeman Obv 6 (1860- 1874). I have only come across one example which was free of this flaw. The colon dot is in most cases round with a small protrusion growing out of the linear circle torwards it. As the die wear increased the colon became more oval shaped and the protrusion grew until they joined together. I suppose it was just a weak point in the dies used. I have at least 2 examples where they have joined.

Hello again, if you want to know more let me know the diameter and weight and I´ll try and get some more info for you via a german forum.

Ludwig Michael von Schwanthaler 1802-1848 - Sculptor Designer of the Statue seen on the Obv. Statue of Bavaria to be seen in Munich on the edge of the Theresienwiese, incidently this is also home of the October Beer Festival. The statue was erected after his death in in 1850 and the medal was issued by King Ludwig the 1st to commemorate this event. The statue is 18m high and made from bronze with a weight of 72 tons! Medal by Birnbock, weight 30,4g Diameter 40mm. Gold plated Bronze, this one was up for auction in 1999 at a starting price of Euro 75. Yours is not the Gold plated version and I am assuming it is probably Tin but can find no info on it. Does it have the name "Birnbock" under the bust?

Hi Peter, I presume you are in the Uk so I do not know how cheap online photo services are over there. I tried to print my own Photos but found the results to be sub standard. My advice is to look online and have the photos printed by a professional service. I find this to be much cheaper in the long run, considering the price of ink cartridges and photo paper. The quality is superb, much better than you can achieve at home.

The 1839 missing colon variety seems only to occur on the 2 pronged Trident coin. The two that I have read " REG: FID. DEF " , the colon completly missing and also the upper dot after "FID". The 1839, 3 Pronged Trident coin of mine, has a complete colon after "DEF" 2x 1838 DEF: and DEF. 1849 REG FID. DEF: (although traces of the missing dots are just visable under a x10 mag) Micheal Gouby lists a few more exmples an his website.

Blocked Die?

The Die setter really cocked this one up

Thanks guy`s. I thought I might have been a little harsh when grading of these coins. My grade for this coin is nEF which seems to be the general opinion.

I undersand that it is thought that the Obv of QV copper farthings were struck from used Sovereign Dies. If this is so, how does this effect the Grading of these coins? , then even true Unc with lustre examples would show signs of wear and in theory would have a true grade of only EF and worst case scenario, nEF! I have included a photo of an 1839 Farthing and would be interested to see what members think as to the grade of this coin. The milky patches are due to the coin holder. Cheers, Gary

I agree with planz666, using a toothbrush is not advisable on any type of coin. A toothbrush is made of nylon and even a toothbrush which is considered soft will leave tiny sractches. Have a look at the bristles of a toothbrush under a x10 magnifiying glass and you will see hundreds of sharp edges! If you must use a brush, I reccommend a good quality, natural hair artists brush with the bristles cut back short to stiffen them up. As for verdigris- If it has not reached the stage of actualy eating away at the coin, I find a good remedy is Contact Spray. This spray is used in the electrical industry to remove moisture and to clean and protect copper connections. It works quite well on copper coins and can prove usefull for bronze. It does not alter the patina or colour of the coin. The coin can be left soaking for as long as you want. The use of a toothpick either soaked with water or again with contact spray can then be used to carefully scrap away stubbon spots of verdigris. I say carefully because even a softwood toothpick can remove the patina from a copper coin if you are not carefull. Copper is a soft metal, bronze is a bit harder. For bronze coins, try soaking the coin in water for a few hours before putting it in the contact spray. I find that most coins with verdigris have already been removed from the source of moisture, consequently the verdigris has dried out and gone hard. Soaking it in water for a while will soften it up before soaking it in contact spray. Do not soak copper (pre 1860) coins in water as this will cause them to loose their sheen and become dull and matt. After having said this, please try it on worthless coins first and if you are not pleased with the results, dont try it on valuable coins and then place the blame on me because you dont like the results.

thats another give away, yes. However if looking for a 1926 mod on the internet it is not always an indicator as many sellers do not photograph the coins at a 90° angle which then eliminates the colon dots as identification (paralex error, I might have spellt that wrong ) The colon between GRA and BRITT is a dead give away and as custard1966 said this was missed by the "major authors"