TomGoodheart

Again, not a laugh, but John Newman seems to have a run of Charles II farthings as buy-it-nows on ebay. I don't know the things from my Uncle George's left lawnmower, but in case anyone is interested you can use this link to look at his other items for sale ... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CHARLES-II-FARTHING-1679-/280914453380?pt=UK_Coins_BritishMilled_RL&hash=item4167ce6384

Interesting. Is that Elizabeth I? Aha. Bit more info here: http://www.pccoinsandcollectables.com/product.php?cat_id=6&sub_id=62&pro_id=460

There. I corrected it for you.

NOPE! All looking promising! I did scan the web for the 8 over 7 and didn't find any matches! I don't suppose there would have been THAT many 8/7 dies either...any rough ideas on how many I would have to rule out? More Rob's teritory that I'm afraid. But there were two ebay listings supposedly for 1578/7/6 sixpences. Maybe email the buyers/ sellers and see if they have photos they would send you? http://feedback.ebay.com.my/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=jerseyjohnjames&ftab=FeedbackAsSeller http://feedback.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=oldgroats&iid=-1&de=off&items=25&which=positive&interval=365

Well, the alternative is to compare it with CR-b dies. You could start by comparing it with the 7/8 here. If it matches, you have your answer. If not .. the search goes on! DNW sale 16 March 2011, Lot 278 (part)

And if you can post a photo of all of the reverse of your coin I can check searches if I get the chance ...

Dies for hammered coins were made by hand. Consequently if two reverses tally in more than a couple of points then, rather like fingerprints, they must be from the same die. Now you need to allow for striking weaknesses, gradual wear and doubling and so on. But essentially the letters will point to the same dot of the outer or inner circle, odd shaped letters will match and so on. Find a photo of an example of a CR-2/CRa reverse and Robert is the brother of one of your parents! And if you post it here alongside a photo of your coin then I will be happy to compare the two and give my views. Now ... do you have a photo of a CR-2/CRa reverse?

Quite possibly IMHO. As you'll know, the figure 8 appears to be quite small by comparison with the 7s and I wouldn't think would extend above the top of that. Whereas the 6 is larger and sticks out above the 7. But I have no expertise in this area. Just my opinion based on the photos.

Not me, no. I spotted it but I'm saving my pennies! And I'm never sure what ebay thinks of listings ending if there are bids on a item. Not that they can do anything, but a bid is supposed to be a contract ...

Not a laugh, just wondered if anyone is following this: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Edward-v1-siver-Hammered-coin-/150847991480?pt=UK_Coins_BritishHammered_RL&hash=item231f3daeb8? Assuming it's genuine, and I have no reason to think otherwise, and not ruined by say polishing, could be worth a bid. High starting bids often put people off and if you could get it for close to the opening price .... (I've tweaked the photo for my own purposes)

I'm sure you've seen this Rob? http://www.cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=212679

was that a lavender blue coin by any chance? Quite likely. Or suzuki4x4, cmoon or any of his other aliases. The photos are a give away.

Did the seller say where he got it? These things have been around a while. I have a pic of one from ebay from 2010 so unless he obtained it well before then I'd say the chances are it's duff.

Yeah, the issued design was know as 'the rocking horse' and that describes it quite well. I suspect there are quite a few coins that with our modern eyes would have looked better with designs that were rejected at the time. Now, if you could just find a coin that had slipped out of the mint with this reverse ... that would solve the problem of funding a collection I'd imagine!

*wonders if that's some obscure reference to sex?* Jolly good! It's been breezy in Blighty so you haven't missed much I don't think!

Well Done Debbie! And after that little challenge it should be no problem at all for you to convince my wife that all the time and effort I spend on coin related stuff is worthwhile and that a few more £,000 to spend on the things would be an entirely justified and welcome gift. Somehow she just doesn't see it ..!

My feeling is TA, LB. The first is a bit contrived, though the T is similar to the one The Telegraph newspaper uses, the engraver has had to stretch it to make an 'a' ..but the LB seems fairly clear to me.

Happy Birthday Chris! Hopefully you're celebrating by getting hammered! Coins that is ....

I don't buy the recoinage idea, otherwise wouldn't it be expected that more coins would be marked in this way that we actually find? Coins that were decent weight were holed so that they could legally continue in circulation and yet examples so pierced are really quite scarce. All other coin was due to be melted down and yet we seem to find marked coin far more frequently than pierced ones. Surely any that failed the test would have been taken in immediately? We know that coin was taken at 5/8 an ounce, in other words people weren't given money for individual coins, what they had was weighed and they were given the bullion value (less a percentage that paid for the process) in return. There were already questions about the fact that weighing the poor quality coin took more time and therefore expense, than had been allowed in governmnet calculations realting to how much the bullion price should be adjusted to pay for the process. I can't see that there would be any official sanction for individually marking coins that were due to be melted down almost immediately. Personally I wonder if it isn't more a folk superstition thing? If you look at this article it says that European charms often require silver coins to be used, which are engraved with marks such as an "X" or are bent. These actions personalize the coin, making it uniquely special for the owner. I'd be interested to know if gold coins are found so marked? If it's just silver (which are generally considered lucky) it might support the idea that it was to do with making a personal charm of some sort?

I didn't really start until I was clearing Dad's house. He was an inveterate hoarder and I took the silver/part silver coins he had to a dealer and came away with a few 'nicer' coins. Then looking through the library to find out a bit more about coin collecting I happened across James Mays' The Splendid Shilling and I was hooked. Shillings were something I remembered from my youff and I decided to collect firsts and major design changes. The later stuff was easy enough, back to around George II but the Stuarts in decent condition were rather out of my budget. Oddly I avoided Charles I as being far too complicated for quite a while. Then I spent a bit too much and Wifey found out and wasn't best pleased by which time I had bought a couple of Charles I shillings. Dad died and left us reasonably well off and Wifey decided that perhaps she was being a bit churlish as it was sort of more my money than hers. She asked how much I reckoned I'd need to build a collection, I told her and she halved it to 10 grand. I decided that would work, but it wouldn't be a very big collection so opted to sell off the other coins and concentrate on Charles I. Through ebay I 'met' other collectors and learned from them and .. the rest is history. As to 'stars', like Rob, my view changes depending on my mood. I'm obviously happy with the coins I feel I got cheap (few though they are!) and there are a few rarities that would be the very last coins I'd part with if I had to sell. Off the top of my head? Maybe this? Not much to look at, I know! But it's one (the better) of the two 'discovery' coins written up by Michael Sharp in the BNJ when the bust was first recognised. Unrecorded until 1995 and though others have come to light since then, it is still quite scarce (I know of 7 other examples). Ex Roger Shuttlewood. Nice to have a bit of numismatic history I think.

Hard to say since the reverse is busier and so marks don't stand out as much, but my feeling is they are much more common on the obverse and usually are in front of the bust. I have seen scratches over the bust on occasions, but mostly it's a cross or couple of parallel lines in the field which suggests to me people wanted them to show. If you just wanted to test a coin unobtrusively you could scratch a flake off the rim or somewhere it wouldn't be so obvious. A small selection of examples on shillings of Charles I: Of course coins do get dig marks and there used (in the days of flips that you stapled closed) to be modern scratches from mishandling when opening the flip or envelope, but most of these marks are quite different from the characteristically deliberate ones we see here IMHO.

Ah, but now you're back Chris, have you seen this brilliant scheme we've all joined? You buy silver bullion coins from them and if you then recruit others to do the same you get your coins for free!! We're all going to be millionnaires!! Just sign here ....

LOL If we only bought what other people said was 'worthwhile' it wouldn't be a very satisfying hobby! If you like it, why not? I don't really see the appeal of quite a lot of the farthings and I know quite a few here don't 'get' hammered coins, but it would be no fun if we were all after the same thing, would it? A collection is a purely personal thing and that's the point. It's about collecting things that appeal to and mean something to us - after all, we're the ones that have to live with it (and hopefully enjoy it). Enjoy your penny pies!

All I know Will, is that whn I Wiki 'network marketing' I get this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_marketing As to the other points, I don't think Tesco asks it's customers to recruit new customers through contracting to a subscription scheme to get 'free' groceries! And tangible assets your bullion may be (of course it is), but it seems to me that you're taking on trust the concept that silver will be worth more than you pay, or even anything at all, when you want to use it as collateral against a purchase. If it all goes pear-shaped and everyone in this scheme decided to sell their bullion at the same time, what do you think will happen to prices? These are hardly scarce assets either, at least compared to the sorts of things people on this forum tend to collect. If I'm proved wrong and you make a fortune, well I'll be delighted for you. But it's not for me.

I think if you pay a fair price then the main factor will be time. Had I kept hold of many coins until today, I would have turned a nice profit on almost all of them. However I wanted the money to buy other coins at the time and didn't. Dealers sell for a profit so are going to want to buy at a discount to the current market value. Wait a few years for the market price to go up and the dealer's offer will approach (and hopefully exceed) what you paid. Sell too soon however ... OK, rarities are a shortcut in that if someone really wants something that rarely comes on the market they will have to pay the asking price. But in the end there's always a risk. The only way to hedge against it is to know your stuff so you don't pay too much and buy what you like in the hope that others will like it too. Personally I wouldn't rush into it. Decide what you like and do some homework. In every coin series there are gaps that are difficult if not near impossible to fill. And when that time comes you will have to pay for the pleasure, so it's always handy to have a 'war chest' for when that coin appears. But knowing which are the really tricky coins to find, and which just take patience, isn't something that can be picked up overnight. If it was, I personally think it would take some of the fun out of collecting! Though you can learn some of it from other collectors - I think that kept me going for about five years, before I started to get a feel for which coins can be found in decent condition and which are almost invariably poor, making better examples particularly desirable. And I'm still learning!