TOY COINS

[DrLarry]

3 hours ago, copper123 said:

Must admit those balmbergers are not the most attractive coins in the world

Sorry I still have to list the Balmbergers...these are a special group referred to as Crude copies and you are right they are pretty ugly ...like the evasion copies I think the uglier the are the scarcer they are LOL   well I suppose if someone gave you a one as a present you would think what a S****e present and fling it !!!

 

I call these ones the "ol big nose" type 

[DrLarry]

I do not have the Sovereign  and no half Sovereign is listed in Rogers or a Crown specifically identified as BALMBERGER's and yet two half crown versions are listed so I am sure there is a good chance there are at least two versions of the former around somewhere.  Or the Balmberger, Nurnberger Spielmarke and the BAVARIEN ones replaced the others.  It would seem strange that all came the same factory of C Balmberger and made between 1893 until 1900.  The date of 1887 misleads us to think this may have been the date of the issue but it uses the T Brock portrait not issued until 1893.

the images below are from the Fitzwilliam Museum the larger denominations sadly have  not been imaged

 

I will continue to search for those that appear missing but again if anyone knows of any please let me know .

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

Half Crown : these are from my collection  #642 white plated iron small lettering .  Oh I see that the image of the large letter version exists in their the collection of D Vorley ( does anyone recognise that collector) #643  

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

Florin : #649 and 650 were known to Rogers one with small lettering and one with larger lettering 0.6 and 1.2 mm respectively this is a NEW unlisted type with an R s above the Crown it seems to correspond with a shilling 656 listed and maybe that the Half Crown and the Florin exist in this format too which would suggest then at least 3 issue types. it is interesting in Rogers as you can see below from the collection in the Fitzwilliam he has this variety but it is not listed in the book although perhaps I simply cannot see the image well in the book 

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

The Shilling two versions are listed #655 and 656 with small and large lettering Rogers mentions the R above the crown for his 656 variety I don't think he had seen one as it is marked RRR* without an image   this one below is 655 ...the reverse is with SHILLING with serifs and small lettering on the obverse 

 fitz example  CM.2754-2003

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

Sixpence 660 #661 #662 three varieties again one with an R over the Crown 

 

Fitzwilliam collection example sadly no other examples are listed I dont yet have one  or the three listed .

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

#670 Three Pence I have no example .  No image of 673 670 is the larger letter variety 

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

The Penny :  this is an interesting issue it seems at odds with the idea of making the lower value coins in copper and is Iron Plated Large letters on both sides with a small RS over the laurel .  As far as I can tell this is a new variety 

 

the obverse seems to match this one #678

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

The Copper Penny #677  the Reverse has large letters similar to the new one above but they are without serifs above whereas in this variety is with serif 

Rogers notes 3 varieties 677 #678 #679 

 

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

The Copper Half penny  : Only one is listed in Rogers #685 no image is in Rogers as he had not seen one so it is hard to know which variety.  In this one the HA is between the trident and helmet it is likely that there exists a version with the Half in small letters in full between the trident and the helmet and perhaps another with the HALF after the one ...I think this is new one unlisted perhaps using one of the lost numbers 680 to 685 

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

One Farthing: #690  a second is listed in Rogers 691 with larger letters on the obverse   and #696 is Brass with 1897 in exergue and a fourth #697 similar but in Copper  the farthing is after the Trident  in both 

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

The Last ones which seem to be made by BALMBERGER are a group NURNBERGR SPIELMARKE I dont have a lot of them as they are pretty Rare this one #632 was unseen by Rogers and has the R on the tip of the crown ...Half Sovereign #633 

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

this one to the Right of the crown # 633 to the right of the crown 

 

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

that is about all I have of these although Rogers only lists one other a Sovereign and a Crown who knows whether others exist possibly ?  

Edited February 26, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

On 2/23/2023 at 10:53 AM, DrLarry said:

just to finish off The Sovereign 

I have just re-examined this Sovereign along with another I have just located and find that this one does not correspond to any of those listed in Rogers  the lettering bgins much further back on the the head and there is a mix of large and small letters in SPEIL MAKE .  a mention is made to an unseen one  #623 b which I thought might be this one but then I found a second one with mixed sizes in the lettering of SPIEL MARKE but in this example the S begins over the VEIL 

[DrLarry]

these two have images from the Fitz the first only the obverse was imaged the second both sides I will add the new one tomorrow 

 

interestingly this one shows numerous over stamping together with misspelling of MARKE using a reversed N it is hard to tell but it also appears that the L of SPIEL is an I  over something 

Edited February 27, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

Here as promised the new one .  As I mentioned no other example illustrated by Rogers appears as this one 

 

the nose points directly towards the centre of the R and the S of SPIEL is at the back edge of the first part of the veil  small letters seem to have been used for BAVARIEN  and a mix of large and small letters for spIeLMarke 

Edited February 28, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

there are a couple of tokens one by Lauer that sadly got away from me recently (but I was only half interested) permission to share from CoinWorldTV in Vienna Austria 

it's one of these Controlling your temper pieces but interestingly I have not seen one in white metal 3.8 gm 22mm  I would think it to be aluminium or Tin ?

 

 

 

if the date is correct it seems to be a very early use of VICTORIA's portrait very nice example of early Lauer .  It is similar to the one in the whist box  but those are gilt brass 

Edited February 28, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

This one is a mystery to me at the moment. It has the ring of silver it may have once been gilt 20 mm 1.2 mm .  if anyone has any ideas please share .  I dont think is it a Greet St Basil's cake coin 

 

Edited February 28, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

2 hours ago, DrLarry said:

there are a couple of tokens one by Lauer that sadly got away from me recently (but I was only half interested) permission to share from CoinWorldTV in Vienna Austria 

it's one of these Controlling your temper pieces but interestingly I have not seen one in white metal 3.8 gm 22mm  I would think it to be aluminium or Tin ?

 

 

 

if the date is correct it seems to be a very early use of VICTORIA's portrait very nice example of early Lauer .  It is similar to the one in the whist box  but those are gilt brass 

the portrait may compare to the  sovereign Mark  by Lauer 1878

Edited February 28, 2023 by DrLarry

[DrLarry]

13 hours ago, DrLarry said:

This one is a mystery to me at the moment. It has the ring of silver it may have once been gilt 20 mm 1.2 mm .  if anyone has any ideas please share .  I dont think is it a Greet St Basil's cake coin 

 

Greek that should read 

[kai1998inc]

On 12/21/2022 at 11:07 AM, DrLarry said:

I have been thinking that it is most unlikely that an update of Rogers will be made (especially at a cost of £125), so I would think that the best thing would be to create a website and enter the modern world.  It would allow the coins to be seen at their best, with the  the best will in the world small black and white images really dont show off the beauty of some of these little characters.  So perhaps that is the way forward. 

I’m late to the party having only just seen this so apologies, but I’m a fellow collector of toy and model money, and I’m currently writing an update to Rogers (about 30 pages in).

[DrLarry]

1 hour ago, kai1998inc said:

I’m late to the party having only just seen this so apologies, but I’m a fellow collector of toy and model money, and I’m currently writing an update to Rogers (about 30 pages in).

Oh great that was going to be my retirement project LOL  I have found numerous new examples in both the British and European Lauer type coins.  When I started these pages I left the Lauer coins for a while as they seemed to hold more information than most.  Where are you based? Nice to meet you by the Way 

 

Larry 

[DrLarry]

1 hour ago, kai1998inc said:

I’m late to the party having only just seen this so apologies, but I’m a fellow collector of toy and model money, and I’m currently writing an update to Rogers (about 30 pages in).

If you get a chance go back and take a look at the last 15 pages and hopefully we will be able to expand on what is available 

[DrLarry]

I  think now I have dealt with a lot of the "non Lauer types" it is time to be begin the Lauer coins themselves.  It is hard to bring the history of the Lauer minting house alive but I did find recently this postcard which shows the mint house in the late 1800's Lauer as a family of minters of tokens and medals began  well before the production of the small coins often only referred to as Lauer Toys.  Nurnberg was as I mentioned a city built of industries that worked in small metal fabrications and in a way a bit like Birmingham was in England.  I am sure the markets opened up once a German Prince sat next to Victoria and the wealth of peoples changed and small present giving became increasingly popular as money was more freely available.  So a confluence of timing and opportunity which blossomed mostly in the the mid 1870's to the late 1880's .  Yes the factory continued into the early 1930's producing medals and the factory was bombed in the late 30's early 40's .  I have written to the toy museum in Nurnberg but as yet have had no communication from them about any history they may know of the production of toy coins.