Coin Reverse Orientation

[ozjohn]

Is there any reason why the RM changed the  orientation of the reverse design on half crowns when the jubilee coins were issued in 1887?

[Mr T]

And why were the bronze coins in medal orientation from 1860 as well for that matter?

[blakeyboy]

I still have trouble with this.

It's like someone got things muddled up years ago, and everyone since blindly followed.

 

My problem goes like this:  I realised many many years ago, medals can be lifted, but if you twist them, this will probably damage the pin or the cloth.

So you mount a medal so that if you want to read the back, you lift it up, like an old-fashioned nurse's watch, not try to rip it off the wearer's jacket.

 

I then found out the orientation labelling was the opposite of what made sense....!!!!!!!@

What??    Why?     Medals have a horizontal 'hinge' at the top, intentionally.

If they were to be twisted, they would hang from a single, rotatable point......

[Diaconis]

2 hours ago, blakeyboy said:

My problem goes like this:  I realised many many years ago, medals can be lifted, but if you twist them, this will probably damage the pin or the cloth.

So you mount a medal so that if you want to read the back, you lift it up, like an old-fashioned nurse's watch, not try to rip it off the wearer's jacket.

Good question Blake, I had never thought about it.

Perhaps due to the solemn nature of the award, the reverse may be intended to be viewed by the owner and not by a curious bystander.

When he lifts the medal when being worn, the orientation will be good for him and the ribbon provides slack to do so. He turns it inwards instead of outwards.

I also think that using a pivoting mount would result in an occasionally reversed medal on the parade ground.

It would be interesting to know the generally accepted reason.

[Bruce]

6 hours ago, blakeyboy said:

I still have trouble with this.

It's like someone got things muddled up years ago, and everyone since blindly followed.

 

My problem goes like this:  I realised many many years ago, medals can be lifted, but if you twist them, this will probably damage the pin or the cloth.

So you mount a medal so that if you want to read the back, you lift it up, like an old-fashioned nurse's watch, not try to rip it off the wearer's jacket.

 

I then found out the orientation labelling was the opposite of what made sense....!!!!!!!@

What??    Why?     Medals have a horizontal 'hinge' at the top, intentionally.

If they were to be twisted, they would hang from a single, rotatable point......

Interesting, would like to learn the reason behind as well.

[Pre1947Silver]

It might be worth having a look through the Royal Mint Yearbooks for this period to see if there is any mention of it - https://library.royalmintmuseum.org.uk/archive/royal-mint-annual-reports

[ozjohn]

Still being curious about the change from coin orientation to medal orientation in 1887 I contacted the Royal Mint. Their reply is attached for information. However US coins are still minted in coin orientation and changing it did not seem to help the George V silver issues. As a general observation US coins seem to be deeper struck than UK coins and possibly a benefit in the quality of strike results..

[Mr T]

Interesting - I would never have guessed that.

Were any of the early bronze patterns medal orientation?

[DaveG38]

8 hours ago, ozjohn said:

Still being curious about the change from coin orientation to medal orientation in 1887 I contacted the Royal Mint. Their reply is attached for information. However US coins are still minted in coin orientation and changing it did not seem to help the George V silver issues. As a general observation US coins seem to be deeper struck than UK coins and possibly a benefit in the quality of strike results..

He's not the David Mason of World Coins, Canterbury (now defunct) fame is he?

[Peckris 2]

14 hours ago, ozjohn said:

Still being curious about the change from coin orientation to medal orientation in 1887 I contacted the Royal Mint. Their reply is attached for information. However US coins are still minted in coin orientation and changing it did not seem to help the George V silver issues. As a general observation US coins seem to be deeper struck than UK coins and possibly a benefit in the quality of strike results..

I'd take issue with his reasoning - i.e. the Jubilee Head obverse - as the change to medal orientation had already been done for bronze nearly 30 years earlier.