DrLarry

thanks for that , so is there any way of telling whether a coin has the rim as part of the design or not?

This collection wasnt sold to me. They belonged to my friends father. His father died recently and I was selling them for him. Some are marked copies but most are not. I do not know how to tell a copy from the real thing. Hunt51 May he forever rest in peace ...REV G father RIP

yes and an old tobacco tin .....OLD Holborn it was for me although that does remind me of another littl;e story on coins I shall write up in my series of coin fables...no coin tales perhaps I should call the book Heads or Tales. I'm glad it all sorted itself out. His discussion with me seemed to suggest some contrition on the subject and he showed some remorse for his mis-selling. The world is in balance and all is well in Numis Land.

In the discussion I had with the seller he said he accepted returns generic so he will take it back.

could someone please tell me what it means when you offer things for sale "within the rules of the forum" ? thanks

the other thing also is that whilst the coins are light enough to exhibit their strength if the cutlery was affected in some way it would be more difficult to "prove" to yourself that they showed magnetic qualities, the knife is too heavy to stick to the fridge the penny has a large surface area relative to the weight. Did it not cause a fire when it hit the shed?

same thing happens in igneous rocks containing iron, as they freeze out of the magma they align themselves with the position of the magnetic field its a fossil record of the magnetic field.

yes most are copper clad steel cores these days

the coins maybe were more exposed the other cutlery may have been in a drawer surrounded by wood which would have dampened the field as wood is a bad conductor of electrical charge (unless it is damp) The lightning if it did "blow up" the shed was mostly likely trying to touch ground with something metallic do they have an iron washing line stand close by?

mmmmm if you pass Iron (and a lot of coins have steel centres I think these days) through an electrical current back and forth you can disrupt the normal alignment of the Iron atoms in the lattice which does make the iron bar magnetised you can I believe re-enforce this phenomena by angling the bar at 23.3333 degrees which is the axial angle around which the earth magnetic poles align, although that is a variable angle as the poles wander. Is this temporary yes I think it might well be it might be that the lightening acting as an electrical charge might create a temporary field ...this is essentially the same process that makes and electromagnet. Most steel (and some other metal) objects have a low level of magnetic field around them this would attract the lightning if it was close by. I would say then it is possible if the lightning was that close. Perhaps you could ask your neighbour if you can collect some of the nails from the shed and see if they are magnetised.

that is very true, they are high quality, 1902 crown, Victorian, made from silver and with good edge lettering. those half crowns have been up on aliexpress for a few years now. Personally I think it is important always to have a reference set of all the fakes they sell. If I died tomorrow and the charity did sell off my coins whilst i know they are fake and seperate from the rest of the collection they might easily get listed . I would like a small metal punch with copy so I could mark them all. The shillings victorian are very hard to tell apart, if you dont know your portraits although there is a flaw up the side of the wreath on the right side on all of them. But they have quite a good ring to them.

how's about ........INTEGRITY has a nice ring to it ...like the sound of silver on glass not that dull thud of pewter.

I feel like an activist again (all puffed up !!!) ......surely someone can come up with a MArvel or DC comic type name for a superhero who forces sellers not to sell fake coins .....come on it's todays challenge

I do not know what coins are fake and what are real. I am only going by what is written on the coin. These came from an older gentlemans collection. I am not out to cheat anyone and I offer a full 14 day return on anything I sell. I will remove them until I can authenticate if they are fake or real - hunt51 there you go looks like he has closed his coin sale down....only took five minutes LOL one has to give him the benefit of the doubt ....methinks

I agree it is important for you to report it to ebay dont even begin to going direct to him as soon as it arrives open a case but also you can report each of those others he is selling. Not one of them is authentic and he knows it perfectly well.....but please for us all and other young collectors out there report them. These people give each person they sting a bitter taste (mixed metaphor sorry ) and it destroys young collectors from getting started. Such sellers are parasitical ...can you tell replicas annoy me LOL !!!!!

that is a very "ugly copy" ...is it right that Queen Victoria insisted on one of the obverse to be removed from circulation because of the bulging eyes?.....if so it is lucky the ppor old dear didn't see this one

I have gone into the site and reported all the fake items to ebay sending a report on each one. I treat it a bit like picking up litter. I have a pick up three policy. I report about 3 a week if I find them not listed as replicas. I have also sent a message to the buyer which ebay will have then on record so when he tries to flog such rubbish again they will have a paper trail.

if you go into a website called aliexpress and search for Victoria penny 1862 you will see that they are about $6 each. so you have only paid twice as much as they cost if you have them sent direct from china. One of the tell tale ways of telling is the "blue blush" tinge they have. If it were a real 62 you would see a crispness to the design sharpness, whereas many of the forgeries have a soft "roundedness" to the design elements. If I were you I would ask for my money back or start an open case :does not seem authentic. Ebay may likely tell you to keep the offensive creature and give you your money back. You just have to say you are going to destroy it with trading standards whihc might be the best thing to do. But as I say they are $6 so you only lost $6 and postage. Good luck

Empirical evidence always is prone to result in at least some pain for someone ....just depends if you are the good end or the bad end of a blunt instrument. I work using a strictly Popperian model. That is not to say that creativity is often the point of genesis of any good idea.

OUCH!!!

LOL this poor guy only came in to ask about value ...all of us analysing its every facet he must think we are a funny bunch.....are we? No need to answer that I will reflect on that too.

It is hard to say the main body of the 3 is more narrow than the normal 3's I have examined (n. 270) but within this population there is variation in the thickness sometimes it can be caused by corrosion not that I am saying this is corroded. The angle makes a hell of a lot of difference to how these things appear verses what they actually are. The central spoke appears to have been knocked maybe thinning it I would look around the coin in this area for any compression marks. The photo is thinning out the peripheral extensions of the 6 and the 8 in places which I also look for now to see if the image is the issue rather than the coin. I cannot see any obvious depressions and rises the shadow areas are not obvious if they are there. there is a darker area inside the three which might be concomitant with a bruise coming from below the 3. A standard photo system might make our lives easier perhaps with a grid which would allow us to be able to see the width of numerals and design elements but I do it myself when selling I angle the light to give the best aspect of the coin, so it is a hard call. On reflection I would say it looks standard and it is the image that is the anomaly not the coin.

Coin # 1. For BRAVERY: I had a wicked father a violent man who would always take anything from us he wanted. I was on holiday in Cornwall and the night before a waging storm had ripped apart the family tent and I my sister and the dog named Bruce sat in the blue Vauxhall Viva all night listening to the claps of thunder and the wack of my father as the rest of the family tried to keep hold of the metal poles, the canvas and my father's fist . Fear controlled our every action when he was around unpredictable as a summer storm. The Morning after was as peaceful and as beautiful a day as you can imagine on a cornish beach in mid summer, the only reflection on the night before could be seen in the masses of wood and seaweed littering the shore and the crashing of the still energised waves. The event, of course, led to a premature departure; but there was still time to be on the the beach once more, more importantly in the jewels of the crowning glory of the coast: the rock pools. I was a light footed creature as a child, unlike now, and knowing I had already spent too much time searching I jumped over a few more pools; scanning for movement of shrimps and fish. The reflection caught my eye first, the sun was at an angle to fall to the back of one pool and something glittered deep. In mid air I stopped sharp on the rocks leaning down legs astride a broad crack filled with water I attempted to reach down but the depth proved too much and i fell grazing my shoulder.... but I had it. The salty blooded water I could taste, but the pain meant very little as in my hand as I opened it was a coin worn and pitted but on it was a face I could not at first recognise. My brothers were at the time heavily into Metal and rock and had posters of T REX on the wall and when I picked up this coin all I could see was the wild hair and profile of Marc Bolan it was the crazy 70's. The coin had been tumbled and I had no idea how long it had been there, but I like to think that it has travelled the sea currents from the wreck of the Association which went down in 1707. The crazy captain ( there by rank rather than sense) forced a group of ships returning across the Bay of Biscay up through a terrible storm. The local story goes that a midshipman, who knew the waters, had advised the captain of the position off the Scilly Isles. Confronted with common ...common sense he had the man hung on a charge of stirring a mutiny. The ships went down with the loss of about 1600 lives that night and carrying a lot of silver, coins are today still coming up from the wreck. So Marc Bolan's (T Rex) or as he is know William the III's 1697 shilling was my treasure ....Of course I got a hiding for coming home bloody and a bit torn but that coin stayed with me hidden for many years. It served as my "weathering the storm coin" growing up with a violent tempest of a father. I lost it at some point when I left home as a kid but in later years I found a few , one on an old setting has the date and loss of the association written into the edge. At times it's worth facing the storm searching for treasure in the calm that comes after and leaves you with something tangible to hold onto. An ironic twist being that the Captain (the father of the ship) sadly survived.... it is strange how bullies often manage to avoid the fates they impose upon others. My first coin. Age 7 Coins can bring us many things Bravery came with this one.

is the collar a steel cylinder that rises up once the planchet is in place ready to be struck then sinks back down to allow the next one in ? I can see how in time the sinking of the die top and bottom would eventually loosen the "fit" . Technically when a coin was struck the metal would thin slightly kept in place by the collar ? they would compensate for that? presumably so if not the reeding on the edge of a silver or gold would end up compressed? I am truly a novice on these matters.....the reeding on the edge is that applied during a separate process? Teeth and raised borders on the edge are they also separate from the die pressing? I understand the process in a modern context but not the older ones. In the Moore patterns you can often see the impression of a series of separate unit "collars" but I presume that is an alternative process and needed for bimetallic coining.

never say never .....I enjoy a challenge