Generic Lad

That is very odd. Why would anyone go to the trouble of counterfeiting such a low-denomination coin?

US Grading services such as NGC/PCGS will ship back many coins that they won't grade due to different things. I've seen coins receive no grades due to: Environmental damage (dug coins, verdigris, sometimes PVC slime) Cleaning Graffiti Scratches Toning of unknown origin Tooled etc. Rather than do what most coin dealers would do which would be to grade the coin with a grade (such as fine, but X flaw) or use a net grade (I think ANACS does do net grading). PCGS and NGC will flat out either refuse to slab it and return it in a flip, or will slab it but refuse to give a numerical grade (and give a details grade) If you submit enough coins to PCGS/NGC a good chunk of them will come back ungraded. The fact that this coin has come back without a numerical grade is not surprising (as it clearly has environmental damage) and it really shouldn't be an indicator that NGC thinks the coin is suspect. Your best bet is to sell it within the slab/flip that NGC has said its authentic because re-submitting it for evaluation at PCGS/NGC is going to give you another no-grade coin.

Check them with a magnet also. Chinese coins of that era are commonly faked. And by commonly I mean I've seen about 20 fake examples for every 1 genuine one. Now, without seeing better quality pictures I can't say for sure if yours is a fake or not, but if a magnet sticks to your coin (even weakly) you've got a fake coin. However, if a magnet doesn't stick to it, you may still have a fake piece, but if it sticks to the magnet, you can for sure know its a fake. What worries me on your example is the "mushiness" of the lettering, although it could just be your photo.

I can tell you that most of the US Zinc cents end up quickly corroded. They literally rot away if not kept in pristine condition. They get spotted even when kept in near ideal conditions.

Happy New Year!

Depends on how much time you want to put into the hobby and if you're concerned about having a "complete" collection or not. There are of course the "traditional" routes, a coin a year, a high grade collection of a certain denomination, a coin from every monarch, maundy sets, etc. Less popular, but still rewarding would be topical sets. For example, you could collect British coins with Lions on them. Or you could collect less-documented coins such as counterstamped coins. The important thing is that you collect what you find interesting rather than what someone else finds interesting. If you've got no desire to spend hours looking for tiny varieties of Victorian bun head pennies, there's no need to collect them. If you love decimal, or even private mint issues, collect them! And it is important that you separate investment and collecting. A good bullion coin is seldom a good collector coin. And a coin that might increase in value over the years may not fit your collection. At the end of the day, collect to have a collection that YOU enjoy, no matter if you are collecting high grade hammered gold, Victorian bronze, decimal or even Churchill Crowns! If you are happy with your coins and happy with the time/money invested in it. It is a good investment for you.

Anything written by Chris Perkins is worth getting!

Cameo proofs mean that the design has a frosted appearance and the fields look mirrorlike. When it comes to American coins, the Franklin half dollar is apt to be the one that shows a huge difference between a non-cameo and cameo proof. . The first image shows a typical non-cameo proof. The coin is shiny, but the design isn't frosted. It is clearly a proof coin, but not a cameo. The second image shows a cameo proof (or if you believe American TPGers, a "Deep Cameo"). The fields are mirrorlike and the design is frosted. When held in hand it looks a bit like a carved cameo. If you believe TPGers there are several different classes of cameo proofs, ranging from Cameo, to Deep Cameo, to Ultra Cameo.

If you go bargain hunting, you can find some scarce coins for cheap. While most of the stuff in a dealer's melt bin, foreign coin bin, and cu-ni bin are indeed junk, if you have the time and patience (and a good eye) you can find great bargains (not investments, but you can find things to flip fairly quickly and make some cash to put into investments). Look for minor varieties that are easy to spot without a loupe. Have a general knowledge of foreign numismatics, particularly the ones with lots of collectors (UK, USA, Germany, Canada, France, etc.) and know what makes a coin better than just melt for those countries. For example, a US coin with a "CC" mintmark is almost always worth at least $30, regardless of the denomination or condition. Better grade and scarcer dates may go for $20,000+. Be able to identify silver and learn how to estimate how much a coin is worth in scrap silver. If you're lucky you can find silver coins for cheap because the dealer thinks they are base metal. 1968 Canadian quarters and dimes are either 99.9% nickel or 50% silver, many dealers don't know that and toss all '68s in the Cu-Ni bin. A magnet will reveal if its silver or not, silver will not stick to the magnet but nickel will stick. Nickel also has a different look than silver. While an extra $2.50 here and there doesn't sound like a lot, its a painless way to accumulate silver, learn valuable skills, have fun and build up savings for an investment grade coin. The question though is where to look. Over here in the US the places I go are: 1) Coin auctions, often the more "boring" pieces will go less than melt and foreign coins routinely go below catalog price. Although I've seen some absurdities such as 20 dateless buffalo nickels go for $30! 2) Family-owned "cash 4 gold" style shops. While a lot of the franchised places won't sell, the smaller, family owned ones would much rather sell to a collector than put something up for auction or ship it off to be refined. 3) eBay is possible, but lately things go for book or even higher, although varieties may be overlooked. 4) Antique malls. These are often a pain to deal with, asking people to unlock cases, looking through overpriced crap. Finding a nice, interesting coin only to find that the seller neglected to put a price on it. Etc.

Hm, interesting. Well either way it seems like it was a pretty good find for 15 cents! Yes, its certainly not a matte proof. Its just interesting that it managed to wind up in the 15 cent bin, I searched around for the other denominations, thinking that perhaps an entire '51 set was dumped but never found any other '51 British coins. Picked out some BU Elizabeth II pennies in there too Along with some other 3d bits.

So, today I was rummaging through the not-so-local coin dealer's 15 cent bin and I found this 1951 threepence. The reverse is mirror like, but the obverse is much flatter. Of course for all I know the obverse could have looked like the reverse once upon a time and it got dinged up by being literally buried under other coins. The problem is, I don't know if it is a proof issue, or just a nicely polished coin. It is: Are there any good die markers to know if it is really a proof or not? And if it is a proof I'm assuming its a normal (and not a VIP) proof? The edges are crisp, but not exactly knifelike.

Got enough money, going to head to the not-so-local coin shop and see what they have. Knowing my luck it'll be closed Going to try to pick out some nice things out of their Cu-Ni bin, perhaps some pennies to look for Freeman varieties. They never seem to have any good silver foreign coins, but perhaps tomorrow will be an exception.

Merry Christmas everyone!

And I'll leave this one here: http://www.littletoncoin.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product5|10001|24551|-1|54179|

'illustration purpose only'? Why? I hate that! With the effort put into the multi-image photo he posted, he could've got a half-decent photo of his ACTUAL coin! If his actual coin was half-decent, I'm sure he would have... Nothing beats Littleton Coin for pulling that crap. It used to be in the dark days before the internet it was THE place to get coins apart from your local dealer (granted, that was before my time ) but today... Aside from the fact that this is an incredibly common date and you can pick it up for $6-7 for scrap silver at just about any place that deals with coins. They went ahead and for the picture: A) Had an uncirculated coin, something that they don't even offer as one of the buying options Had a proof coin, again something they don't even offer as a buying option http://www.littletoncoin.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product5|10001|24551|-1|23246|89305

Where is "Indya"? I know nothing about Indian coins other than the scrap values for the silver ones, is "Indya" on the genuine ones or is that just a mistake by the forgers?

Slabbing with a TPGer is like a lottery. Sometimes you win big, sometimes you lose out big time. Myself I haven't slabbed any because things can go wrong. A lot of things end up just getting slabbed "genuine" due to some obscure defect ranging from cleaning (despite the fact that other coins with the same amount of cleaning can be slabbed...) or even questionable toning. I've also noticed that NGC/PCGS seem to grade on a curve with older coins getting better grades than newer coins even though they are in the same exact state of preservation.

Since that is NGC slabbed I'm going to go out on a limb and say they graded it MS-64 or MS-65. Myself I'd grade it MS-62, while the coin looks to have no wear (not sure if the flatness on the obverse to the right above the ear is wear or just a weak strike) and very few bagmarks, it is a fairly weak strike with the hair not striking up fully, the first A in BRITANAR looks weak, the left side of the wreath looks weak also, same with the crown where the pearls don't look to be fully struck up. Aside from a little rim nick at about 8 o'clock on the reverse, its in pretty good preservation but IMO the weak strike on some of the central design (mainly the crown) should make this grade lower than a fully struck coin in the same preservation.

3 looks to be an 180(7?) George III copper. Half penny?

Out of all the fake coins (and replica coins) I've seen/owned, I've only seen 2 or 3 stick to a magnet while all the rest did not. The typical ones I see (fake US silver dollars) are usually copper-nickel or silver-plated copper and as such they don't stick to the magnet. However, a magnet is quite useful for testing jewellery because most fake jewellery will be silver/gold plated nickel or steel, although I have seen some gold plated brass rings that are stamped 14K that won't stick to a magnet.

Are there any good references for older British medals? It doesn't have to be too specific but I'd just like something with lots of pictures and good general information since it seems like you can get nice, old medals with better designs than the period coinage in excellent condition for a fraction of what you'd pay for the actual currency.

I saw that over there. I read about spittal and tinfoil on hammered.(Not to rub) What's a clad coin? Is it something an archaeologist pulls out of the wall of a 20thC house? Very good question, I hope I don't have one! Most of this "tissue test" comes from people in the US who coin-roll hunt, or who don't know if a foreign coin is silver or not. When opening up rolls of half-dollars to search for silver, there are 90% and 40% silver coins and coins that have no silver. When looking at the edges, its easy to tell if a coin is 90% silver or not because a 90% silver half dollar will be solid white. 40% silver coins look similar to coins with no silver in them, although they might look a bit "green". 40% halves were minted from 1965-1970 but there have been reports of some very rare wrong planchet errors dated 1971. The problem is, people flood forums anytime there is a funny looking 1971 edge and claim its a rare error worth $1K+ (I've never seen someone discover a 1971 on a 40% silver planchet despite reading 75 threads+ about it). Since apparently a lot of people in the US don't have a scale to weigh them, people have come up with the "tissue test" to help mitigate the flood of these false threads. Among US coin collectors, a non-silver coin is often called "clad" because US quarters/dimes dated 1965-present (and post-1970 halves) are copper-nickel clad. You can see the cladding on the edge where there will be the white stripe of nickel and the reddish-brown of copper. US collectors will also incorrectly refer to non-silver but non-clad coins (such as 99.9% nickel Canadian coins) as clad, and so in US coin forums clad just means non-silver. Even more confusingly 40% silver half dollars are correctly called silver-clad, but such a coin would not be called "clad" in a US forum. Really, the best test for circulated coins to tell if they are silver is the "sound test" (this is quite useful when rummaging through a dealer's "junk bin") copper-nickel coins will "ping" when dropped while silver will "clank" although the alloy does make a large difference (a sterling coin will sound different than a 40% or 50% silver coin). Of course this test isn't exactly recommended for expensive high grade coins! Forgot to mention, clad on eBay has a different meaning, generally meaning plated in order to deceive buyers with titles like: "1 Troy ounce .999 clad silver bar" which have 1 troy ounce of something like nickel or copper that is plated with pure silver.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1891-Queen-Victorias-one-large-penny-coin-recondition-and-sanitize-just-for-you-/170950467309?pt=US_World_Coins&hash=item27cd711eed Well, that's one way to advertize a cleaned coin...

thank you for that,i apreciate it. trying to find out about coins is harder then i thought haha. is there any value to this coin? i will try and upload much better pictures later on. thanks Its worth more than 20p, however I can't really tell you how much more because I'm not really sure what the market would be over there. If it was, say, a dime with those errors in the US it would run in the $3-5 range.

Its possible that the top of the cross is a possible doubled-die? The problem is that having it on both sides is more of a sign of strike doubling, a one-off error that is worth substantially less than a true doubled die. The blobs would be die breaks, also one-off errors (although with a large enough sample size you could see how the die breaks progressed, although that is nearly impossible with something as common as the 20p)