Bronze & Copper Collector

There is definitely a problem when those in a position of authority, whose work is held to the highest standards, make basic errors of attribution that are accepted by the community merely because they are who they are…. These errors of attribution cost can buyers (I don’t call them collectors necessarily) thousands of dollars each time the coins are sold and are in doing so the error of mis-attribution is perpetuated… CAVEAT EMPTOR!!! I do not call into question the subject of grading nor the determination of whether the coin is genuine or not….. I only question the the fact of the attributions being correct…. I do not profess to be an expert on all coins, but those I do know, I can determine for myself when an attribution is incorrect… I acknowledge that it is impossible to know everything about everything, but, if you are going to accept a fee for that determination, then at least make the attempt to be correct and stand behind your work…. If you do not know the answer do not profess a professional determination that unfortunately is accepted as gospel, (although it should not be) by some... The advice that is always proffered, "Buy the COIN and NOT the SLAB" could not be more apropos than in this situation...

Just as one TPG handled the 1860 farthing Mule Mis-Attribution fiasco a few years back.... LMAO!!!! They refused to acknowledge any error, take any responsibility, nor admit any culpability... And in doing so essentially created a new variety.....

Same two coins now on Teletrade.... NOT a 1862 Small date on Teletrade.... Same coin previously sold in Stacks/Bowers Auction "1862 NO reverse Signature on Teletrade" Same coin previously sold in Stacks/Bowers Auction

That's a nice F169 Gary! It's certainly better than the London Coins auction example, and the best I've seen. Nice open 3s too, but Gary1000 has pipped you! Especially that obverse, which must be GVF to NEF. Thanks, I think I was the 1st or 2nd underbidder on the example sold on ebay....

SPECIMEN 2

I currently have two 1903 open 3's in my possession, both essentially in about the same condition.... Eventually, I'll probably part with one, along with some other duplicates that I have..... SPECIMEN 1

.

Hi Gary, I only picked up the dated 1844 and the 'PENNEY' misspelt models, which I believe were yours. I had the chance to buy the all-silver model too, but missed out on that one. Really lovely coins! Your 1* (F164A) certainly puts mine to shame. I've never seen a better one. While on the subject of Edward VII, do you have better than F versions of the 1903, open 3, or the 1909 F169 (which Freeman has as R9, but is way rarer)? A fellow forum member has an NVF Open 3 and I'm sure a VF example appeared on eBay some time ago, but otherwise everything else seems to be low grade. Here is my F-169 - I've been told about the 3rd or 4th finest known... 1909 F-169 1903 open 3 in the next post

The collector you mention on my side of the pond is probably Gary Schindler ("Bronze & Copper Collector" on the Forum)...he has one of everything it seems..... Yes indeed! I'm sure he must have some gaps... In fact I think I have a couple of model pennies he used to own but no longer collects. I may be wrong though. I believe that you do.... I gave up on the models, and sold them all, including the few RARE ones that I had.... Also, I do have several gaps in my collection, although I did recently acquire the 1870 with dot under the Y, RLC35 has a much nicer specimen though.... Here is my F-164A, I believe it is the coin in question....

I know of several 1877 pennies incorrectly attributed as small date in NGC holders as well as an 1841 no colon penny attributed as with a colon... This does not even approach the debacle of PCGS mis-attributing an 1860 toothed border farthing as a mule, and being firm in their position, despite input from several experts informing them of their error, and refusing to admit or correct the error...

I recommend the CD to anyone who collects half-pennies...

As stated above, definitely Obverse 6. Freeman identified an 1862 with obverse 2, and after his book was published a specimen was discovered with obverse 3.. Both are extremely rare, with the obverse 3 being the rarer of the two.. I concur with the comments regarding the reference books... I too use all three volumes in my studies of the varieties....

Both Stacks Lots are F-39s obverse 6 , reverse G Neither have obverse 2 (F-38, Gouby-A) nor obverse 3 (Unlisted in Freeman, listed as Gouby- Neither are the half-penny date

How does such a horrible scratch appear on BOTH sides? Don't know. It does look pretty awful doesn't it, but beggars can't be choosers with such rarities, and it sold for £2100 Not a scratch... CRACKED PLANCHET

Possibly the submitter thought it was the rarer F-593A...

I've seen over a dozen of the N/Z's, and every one of them had the recut A...

Looks like an F-15 with a central cut ribbon... Obverse 4 variant with a central cut ribbon (Gouby obverse G) and a reverse D........ I don't know if the weak areas are from a weak strike or from being struck through something....

Not me! Just thinking if he had gone to the right of the Lighthouse, it would have been rarer still LOL.. I was just going to say the same thing.... Great minds and all that.... Only a handful known of those..... Only one, surely? There was one reported that made me aware of it, and I currently own one, and know of one other... so that would make at least 3....

Not me! Just thinking if he had gone to the right of the Lighthouse, it would have been rarer still LOL.. I was just going to say the same thing.... Great minds and all that.... Only a handful known of those.....

An 1862 obverse 2 penny, but there is only an image of the reverse..... link to auction

Just wanted to let everyone know that I've been getting a suspended user page when I go to the GBforums hosted by Hussolo and now got some sort of hacker screen showing up.... I also just went to retrieve an email from OnlineCoins and they look like they might have been hacked also..

Nice copy Gary. Adding your coin to those known already, makes four (4) total! I am sure there are more out there though. Davidrj may have a point about the available quantity of 1922 "Dots", due to that part of the coin wearing first! Thanks Bob, I'm sure there are a few more that we don't know about yet.....

as promised... images of my 1922 dot on trident

Hardly! Different usernames, but even if you reckon they have one username for the States and one for the UK, that doesn't excuse that the coin appears to be in Lawndale, California and in Warwickshire, England, at one and the same time. Sorry, I was looking at the links and not the auctions that were listed in the next post.... Mea Culpa

I have one (I'll post in a few days when I get home).. I know of maybe 3-4 others, probably a few more out there....