Newbie Sovereign Collector

[Mr T]

Mr T, is there any companies or person that you can recommend?

I've bought a few sovereigns from this guy before: http://www.drakesterling.com/coins-for-sale

He seems to have branched out into coins that aren't sovereigns in recent times but I think the bulk of his stock is sovereigns and he seems to know them well. International postage may be a bit annoying though.

[joedredd]

Thanks Mr T

[drakesterling]

Thanks for the plug Mr T.

Going back to what Mark from Ipswich wrote: I've found good deals from both the dealers and auctions. Auctions in the UK tend to be quite competitive, and I've been able to buy coins from retail dealers at very favourable prices compared to the auction houses. Having said that, there are bargains at auctions too. So keep your eyes peeled on both venues and don't rule the dealer out on the basis that he is a dealer and must be more expensive.

Eric Eigner

Edited October 27, 2015 by drakesterling

[joedredd]

Thanks Eric, well I have spent some much hard earned cash lately on graded and raw coins and overall I am up on what I paid so very happy.

Have made some good contacts re dealers who sell sovereigns on a regular basis. Many thanks for everyone's advise and input it has been much appreciated.

Saving towards the next quality sovereign.

[azda]

Drake, i'm not quite understanding your website, you have a British telephone number Set the coins Are priced in AU Dollars?

Are you in Australia or the UK?

[Nordle11]

They have an Australian number on there too, maybe they're based in Australia but with customer service available in both countries?

[azda]

Never saw the Australian number which is probably where the confusion came from

[TomGoodheart]

Only just spotted this. I noticed your name Joe and thought .. uh? But now the comic connection makes sense!

(I used to love 2000AD when it first came out, though I don't read comics these days.. Yeah, I'm old!)

.

[drakesterling]

Drake, i'm not quite understanding your website, you have a British telephone number Set the coins Are priced in AU Dollars?

Are you in Australia or the UK?

Hi David, I'm based in Australia but have a UK number to make it easier for UK collectors to call. I should probably have dual pricing on the site, a price in dollars and a price for sterling. Not a bad idea.

Eric

[TomGoodheart]

There's a bit of gold in Elsen's latest offerings in case anyone is interested?

http://www.elsen.eu/Auction127/emodule/490/egallery/177

T

Edited November 10, 2015 by TomGoodheart

[Stuntman]

Wow! When you say "a bit of gold"... My goodness!

[Mynki]

Just out of interest what do people think about proofs vs bullion coins?

What the pros and cons of proofs etc?

[Stuntman]

In my novice opinion - the proofs (certainly the modern ones) hold a lot more visual appeal, but they don't have either the honest charm of the bullion coin or the close connection to the gold price. And I feel happy handling the bullion sovereigns whereas you wouldn't, shouldn't or couldn't with the modern proofs.

I'd rather spend modern proof money on an older bullion coin such as a nice Victoria shield reverse, or perhaps a Guinea or fractional guinea.

I've only got a few modern bullion sovereigns but I'd love to add a small handful of older ones at some point.

[Mynki]

I've started collecting sovereigns, nothing at all to get excited about just yet but I keep looking.

I agree Spinks prices do not accurately reflect the results of coins realised at auction.

Yes I'd be prepared to use dealers rather than our man in Nicaragua, and certainly our man in Nigeria. But some do seem on the high side on occasion which for me personally make auctions look more attractive. So what can you do? Is it worth making an offer to a dealer if you believe they're a little high or even very high?

[azda]

I've started collecting sovereigns, nothing at all to get excited about just yet but I keep looking.

I agree Spinks prices do not accurately reflect the results of coins realised at auction.

Yes I'd be prepared to use dealers rather than our man in Nicaragua, and certainly our man in Nigeria. But some do seem on the high side on occasion which for me personally make auctions look more attractive. So what can you do? Is it worth making an offer to a dealer if you believe they're a little high or even very high?

Spink prices are for all metals, not just gold. Some of their prices for other coinage are also high, some low but it's not just dealers who use their bible, collectors also use it, but there is other price guides out there for all coinage of the U.K, you don't need to think Spink is the holy grail of pricing. Buy another 2 up to date price guides and take the average of the 3 and then see how much difference there is.

Dealers also have to earn a living, but there are rarities in all denominations which you'll never pick up at bullion value no matter how much you think it's worth. If you bought a rare Sov at bullion price you'd be happy but would you be happy if the bullion price was 50% lower than when you bought the coin and someone else is expecting you to sell it at the bullion rate of the day? I very much doubt it.

If you like sovs, stick to the early Victoria years, but don't expect them to come at bullion value, it just ain't gonna happen.

[Mynki]

Yeah, aware of what Spinks sell Azda.

To be honest price guides offer some info, but I find it better to create a spreadsheet and detail all sales records in recent years, fees and VAT included of course. It's time consuming but results in more accurate valuations etc. The other benefit is you get to look at many examples of a coin you're interested in.

To me it's a hobby, I suspect the bairn will inherit the collection, no plans to flip anything, just collect as a hobby. However I want to ensure I'm not paying over the odds. You've mentioned Bucks coins in recent times so know exactly what I'm referring to.

[Rob]

The question of not paying over the odds is rather nebulous. On that basis you should never have bought your second coin because the market probably moved perceptibly up in the interim and the books hadn't caught up. Far better to accept that you will overpay for some, but pick up others cheaply, both alongside the coins that cost the 'right amount'. This also requires a defined 'correct price'. If I were you I would buy something if it was within say 20-25% of my mental ballpark figure. You will never get it right 100% of the time, nor will you consistently pay too much. Bargains were to be had at DNW today for example. All collections are a mixture of over and underpaids.

[azda]

The question of not paying over the odds is rather nebulous. On that basis you should never have bought your second coin because the market probably moved perceptibly up in the interim and the books hadn't caught up. Far better to accept that you will overpay for some, but pick up others cheaply, both alongside the coins that cost the 'right amount'. This also requires a defined 'correct price'. If I were you I would buy something if it was within say 20-25% of my mental ballpark figure. You will never get it right 100% of the time, nor will you consistently pay too much. Bargains were to be had at DNW today for example. All collections are a mixture of over and underpaids.

The other Point being is that Spink Compiles their values from the previous year, so by the Time the Book comes out it's already obsolete, so checking through the 2015 auction results from around various auction houses would give a better guide.

The reason i mentioned buckscoins was that he'd bought a Sov from Londons and in ttheir assesment of the coin it was good fine and the underlying numeral or whatever it is, in their eyes was indistinct, bucks had upped it a half grade and then became a 7 over 5. You Are doing the right thing by going through auction houses realised prices and you maybe can Buy Low grade sovs at bullion +20% but higher grade Viccies or rarities i doubt you'll get at bullion prices.

[Mynki]

I think I need to add that it should go without saying that dealers need to earn a living, I'd be being a bit harsh to say the least if I thought otherwise. That said a 1915 Austrian gold 4 ducat restrike can be had from Bullion by post for £367 today direct from their website. Another dealer, MSOWL99 who apparently is someone called Alison Chapman and has featured on ITV's Dickinson's Real Deal and Secret Dealers has the very same coin for sale in her ebay store (Ebay item number381459506891) for £850!!!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4-DUCATS-COIN-AUSTRIA-DATED-1915-986-FINENESS-14-0-GRAMS-RARE/381459506891?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140122125356%26meid%3D9b5c5cf737e34718b126e24ada24cb6d%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D151880927329

With that in mind I'm sure people can understand the need to exercise caution and do their homework before making a significant purchase. Now to be fair as I've portrayed Bucks Coins in a slightly negative light, I did purchaser a 1 ducat coin from him some time ago for a reasonable price, less than the bullion by post price etc.

Again, it should go without saying that not all dealers should be tarred with the same brush, there are some truly excellent and honest people out there.

As for buying rarities at BV. I'm not that lucky, I'd never expect to do that. From looking at the auctions it seems to me that most sales go for their market rate with only a few bargains to be had. Gold is at a fairly low price today and single sovereigns retailing at £190 each for single purchases. Sell it or any other sovereign back to the same dealer and you'll receive just £164 be it a 2015 bullion coin or something considerably rarer as they don't pay for numismatic value. They do however sell rare coins with that factored in with no description as to the condition of the coin. So newbies to sovereigns as has been really do need to understand the difference.

[Mr T]

Thanks for the plug Mr T.

No worries.