Peckris

ROFL Bagerap Makes up for the fact there is no link in Stuart's original post.

These tokens are becoming increasingly appealing to me. The scope for collecting is a little overwhelming though. Do you have any particular collecting goals Brandon or just whatever pieces take your fancy? I collect the tokens with horses on them -- and, any others that strike my fancy along the way. I never understood the "fill this hole in my album" method of collecting. I much prefer to collect what I like, even if it seems a bit scattered to others. I guess it depends if - like me - you started out as a date run collector (with a bit of 'type' and 'haphazard' thrown in) then converted to type collecting. Having said that, I do like my date run of bronze pennies but draw the line at getting every micro-variety.

I think en-medaille, upright, or inverted are more sensible terms than 'horizontal' or 'vertical'. One person may be talking about an axis (though this isn't a geometry class!), whereas I was using the everyday sense of the plane you rotate something in - horizontal if both sides are the same way up, and vertical if they are at 180º to each other. The two arrow convention (↑↑ and ↑↓) is clearest of all, which I suspect is why catalogues like Spink's use it.

Thanks for the info Rob. I'll keep looking out for a topnotch currency 1806 halfpenny though it might be a long wait.

Agreed. I think the strike is one reason why they are so difficult to find compared with the penny and farthing - perhaps there was some problem with the halfpennies as they rarely have that desired crispness? Gorgeous reverse though.

They might not be scratches, but traces left by rubbing with the wrong kind of cloth? At any rate, I find it hard to see anything more than very slight rubbing in places, and no actual wear anywhere. I'd say it was virtually 'as struck' and therefore AUNC.

They would not slab it due to the verdigris. The 'verdigris' is inactive - a coin green from being buried keeps that patina forever, and doesn't deteriorate further; there's often no pitting either, just a glossy green finish. However, someone ought to authenticate it before it goes into auction, as that will ensure a good price for it.

Argument summarised in a nutshell: 1. American TPGs are better at American coins (PGCS, NGC, etc) - the British slabber CGS is better for UK coins 2. Americans are mad for slabs and many won't buy a coin unless it's slabbed, not having bothered to learn the art of coin grading for themselves 3. Therefore slabbing is taking off in a big way as Americans are the biggest coin market by far 4. British collectors are more reluctant to see their coins 'entombed' though CGS are trying to change that 5. If you've already got a collection in cabinets and trays, there's no easy way to fit slabs into that system 6. Not all slabbed coins are actually authentic despite the guarantee (Chinese fakes fool even the experts) 7. Many slabbed coins command a massive premium on eBay, even among British buyers

He will politely tell you what the initials stand for, then he will PM you giving more information

No - you rotate the coin either horizontally or vertically. If the sides are the same orientation, you rotate horizontally, if 180º degrees apart, you rotate vertically.

It's actually the other way about - Geo III is horizontal (↑↑) while George IV is vertical (↑↓). I suspect you have good examples? Mind you, there ARE a lot of contemporary forgeries, but they are silver-washed copper, so they're pretty obvious.

I'm a troll No really, I am - ask Dave

Hah! Really really high grade 1806 halfpenny, anyone? Can't find one to match my other two denominations, not for love nor money, yet it's 'supposedly' a very common coin. :angry:

PM Dave (azda) - he will set you straight! Otherwise, it's a 'love that dare not speak its name' for fear of being sued!!

It's not my coin - yet It is offered at £25 which seemed to me to be a really good price but I'm a little hesitant because I have no real clue yet when it comes to valuing coins. I know that grading comes with experience and I have tried using some books & websites as references so as to know what to look for. Another thing I'm not sure about is the difference in colour on a 1806/07 penny. I know that uncirculated are always going to look different but even the worn ones appear to be vastly different shades - from almost a dark chocolate brown to a much lighter shade like the one I posted above. Is this from cleaning or just different lighting on the photo? Thank you for the advice, collecting in EF is just what I was thinking because I like a slightly worn look (I like to think the coin had a useful life!) but at the same time I want most of the detail because they are beautiful to look at. I already have a couple of Victorian half crowns and I love them but I just can't afford to build a large collection of them so I think I will maybe just have 1 really nice silver per monarch. I'd say £25 was a perfectly reasonable price for that There's a very big colour range in 18th Century coppers - from pale red/brown to virtually black. Whether this is due to small variations in the metal mix used, or the environmental conditions of storage, or both, is hard to say. Photography would also be a factor. There is some variation too in bronze, and it doesn't really settle down until the mid-1920s. As long as a coin has eye appeal for you, and it hasn't obviously been polished or cleaned, then go for it! That's interesting about the colour range - adds a bit of mystique and individuality! Do I need to be conscious of spotting a coin which has been cleaned? I've read that it greatly reduces a coin's value. I'm guessing this also depends on their metal content? Cleaned copper is usually pretty easy to spot - it has an unusual bright look as if Brasso or something similar had been used. You can't use dip for copper, but it can be 'whizzed' (you'll see faint striations all over it) or some chemical may have been used which again will make the coin look unnatural.

It's not my coin - yet It is offered at £25 which seemed to me to be a really good price but I'm a little hesitant because I have no real clue yet when it comes to valuing coins. I know that grading comes with experience and I have tried using some books & websites as references so as to know what to look for. Another thing I'm not sure about is the difference in colour on a 1806/07 penny. I know that uncirculated are always going to look different but even the worn ones appear to be vastly different shades - from almost a dark chocolate brown to a much lighter shade like the one I posted above. Is this from cleaning or just different lighting on the photo? Thank you for the advice, collecting in EF is just what I was thinking because I like a slightly worn look (I like to think the coin had a useful life!) but at the same time I want most of the detail because they are beautiful to look at. I already have a couple of Victorian half crowns and I love them but I just can't afford to build a large collection of them so I think I will maybe just have 1 really nice silver per monarch. I'd say £25 was a perfectly reasonable price for that There's a very big colour range in 18th Century coppers - from pale red/brown to virtually black. Whether this is due to small variations in the metal mix used, or the environmental conditions of storage, or both, is hard to say. Photography would also be a factor. There is some variation too in bronze, and it doesn't really settle down until the mid-1920s. As long as a coin has eye appeal for you, and it hasn't obviously been polished or cleaned, then go for it!

No - it lacks the Bottled Tan look of his

Fancying? Yes! Affording? No!!

That's not your coin, right? Even so, it's a perfectly collectable example of its type, and if all your 18th / early 19th Century coppers were like that, you'd have a nice collection and great fun to acquire. You could - even now - set out to collect bun pennies in EF, which are a long way below UNC in price being relatively more common. Edward VII too, though by George V you'd want to be looking at GEF minimum (unless you actually PREFER the slightly more worn coins, in which case picking up Geo V will be a doddle). For 20th Century coins you could add in halfcrowns and crowns, as from 1887 onwards - wreath crowns and Edward VII excepted - examples in EF are affordable. For Edward VII you could settle for a 1902 halfcrown in EF or near.

Without the green, the penny would be Fine/Fair (obverse/reverse). But it is green... So, if it's not a 4, it would have virtually no monetary value but would certainly be an interesting keepsake. If it IS a 4, then it's a different matter entirely. The coin - even in that condition - would have a rarity value and should be entered into an auction, e.g. London Coins, once it's been officially verified. You're talking hundreds of pounds, possibly creeping up to 4 figures if the right bidders are there?

4 is known, and not as rare as the 5 in that article, but it would still be rare. However, it doesn't look quite straight to my eyes - can you zoom in, macro-style, and get a close-up of the date? The penny has the characteristic green of a long buried bronze coin. That's a chemical reaction probably similar to verdigris, but in the case of burials, where exposure to air is not a factor, the process has become inert and though the green is permanent, it won't deteriorate further.

The penny is certainly the least rare of the three 1860 copper coins.

Here's an 1821 sixpence (the R of BRITANNIAR) :

That's a nice ancient - and without the bright 'cleaned' look so many of them have.

Hmm. It doesn't look to me so much like an A - more like a cud?