Gary D

And as to the patron saints, mostly a bunch of foreigners. St David was the only home grown one as he was actually Welsh, St Partick was reportedly Romano-British (English). And as for St George and St Andrew, if they wanted to enter the country now a days they would probably have to hide out in the back of an artic crossing the channel.

I think that's the point. This gentleman in the USA has obtained a collection of coins with a statistically unfeasible bias towards a scarce variety, probably before the variety was even noted. He must have got them from somewhere. As Sherlock Holmes said, when you have eliminated the impossible, what remains, however improbable, must be the truth. I didn't realise they were hard to get I've had BUs of all four (toned and bright) for some time.

Bugger, the scrote said it belonged to his grandfather. I gave him fifty notes for it.

The only way to tell if there was an H there would be to burnish the coin and apply some acid. This would bring out the stress lines caused by the minting process and would show if there had ever been an H there or not.

I would suggest that the H wore away with the outer circle, there does seem to be a gap there.

It's a Gary Phelps £15 copy

Deleted

I'd would suggest a damaged die like a dot

Just call me a party pooper for bringing this thread back on topic. I have just got a copy of Spinks 2011 to bring my coin collection value up to date ready for the annual insurance, I always leave getting Spinks a few months to give time for the price to drop, I don't like to pay much over £15 for a copy. Anyway it would appears that the value of my collection has gone up by an eye-watering 22% since last year, there have been some editions but Edward VII and early George V have risen strongly. My 1922 penny has gone up something like £2k unless it's a typo, the values have stayed the same but moved down a grade. And where has £115 for a 1937 proof silver 3d come from, it was £12 last year?

Finaly got a photo that may help, the edge would appear to have a thicker edge half way through. Looks to be within normal mint tolerences to me.

Show off. lol - exactly what I was thinking! Nice penny though - Azda's that is... Sorry Jay, yours is a touch umm beaten up?! Nice rub with a bit of Duraglit and you could put a good shine on it. Probably make a extra grade with ease.

The 3s may fit but what about the teeth, they are not in the same place.

Both the Crocker and Workman pieces are pretty poor making the ebay one much more desirable. I believe there are at least a couple of very high grade examples around that would be far beyond the reach of us mere mortals. Here's another picture of mine, definitly better than both the Crocker and Workman.

I think I'll have to get my 164a reavaluated ebay

In hindsight, I wish I'd gone higher and I believe you got a steal at £330. I think up to £500+ would still have been worthwhile. The main thing I notice with eBay is that 'expensive' (i.e. genuinely rare and/or in outstanding condition) coins generally go cheaply, while 'cheap' (i.e. less rare and/or poorer condition) coins are often expensive. If that makes sense? I sell a heap of stuff every week on ebay (as you are well aware Steve) and concur. Mediocre common dross does okay, silver is obviously very hot at the moment, but quality or rare items do bugger all. I think if I was wanting to sell something like the open 3 in question I would either put it into the sale I am runing up Norf in August (big plug there) or (more sensibly) sell at London Coin Auctions as they are, in my opinion, the likliest house at the moment to maximise a price on a rare penny. I was also of that opinion so put a Gouby X and 1909 with dot into London coins and they did bugger all.

In hindsight, I wish I'd gone higher and I believe you got a steal at £330. I think up to £500+ would still have been worthwhile. The main thing I notice with eBay is that 'expensive' (i.e. genuinely rare and/or in outstanding condition) coins generally go cheaply, while 'cheap' (i.e. less rare and/or poorer condition) coins are often expensive. If that makes sense? I bid £555

Definitely an open 3... I was the under bidder at £310 and rather hoped to get it. Now I wish I'd gone more as it's the best I've ever seen too, especially the obverse I'll be putting a run of the mill fair up for sale soon, well once the new one has arrived Congratulations! I have a fair open 3 in the collection already, hence my interest in this better one. Looks like I'll have to start digging deeper as I've lost out on a few coins recently! I'm beginning to dispair over the prices on ebay, I've been the bride's maid not the bride so to speak on so many occassions now. Anyway after seeing what the two Colin Cooke open 3s went for it was very difficult to make a sound judgement so you would have had to go a long way to have beaten my highest bid. I'm not sure where is the best place to sell rare stuff these days as they seldom perform on ebay, but saying that the auction houses vary greatly also.

Definitely an open 3... I was the under bidder at £310 and rather hoped to get it. Now I wish I'd gone more as it's the best I've ever seen too, especially the obverse I'll be putting a run of the mill fair up for sale soon, well once the new one has arrived

Gary, I have found another auction result you might be interested in, described as "BMC --. F 164A. As Dies 1+C. Gouby B. Fine, extremely rare". It went for £800 with 15 bidders. Dont agree with the grading though! F164A James Workman Collection We discussed the F164A a while ago on this site... Here's a really nice example from a fellow member. Yes, I think when I sell my collection about 8 years time Colin Cooke will get first dibs.

The Crocker piece in my opinion was well over priced, mine in F is valued at £200 for insurance. I was a bit disapointed as I found it on ebay only a few weeks after the Crocker auction. Still at $2.35 aussie dollars I wasn't robbed. flippen heck that makes this poor coin the most valuable one in my collection thanks for the info David.

As far as I can judge, you are quite correct. That sad and sorry specimen is indeed the Gouby X or hollow neck type. In that condition for wear, worth £30 -£40 based on recent sales. As it is, well £0.99 looks about right if you can live with it. Well, I bought the penny for £3.20 and guess what? It arrives and it's clearly not the same penny as in the photo! The received coin is so worn/buffed up with a wire brush that the majority of the teeth on the obverse no longer exist. So I emailed the seller (a Polish gentleman it would seem) and he states that there can't have been a mix up because he only had the one coin dated 1911! Yeah right! Anyway, he eventually refunded my money and, even though I told him the coin was one of the worst I had ever seen and worth nothing more than scrap, insisted on having it back! I should have known he was a waste of space. My search for a Gouby X continues. Just an observation Steve but they are clearly 2 different Pennies in the same picture (the lines in the background are unbroken as is the light reflection), so the obverse you were looking at did not belong to the 1911 reverse. Look like an observe 3 so probably a 1922 with 1927 reverse

Still worth a couple of hundred quid even in that condition.

"the writing on the back is writen backwards. " Gary said that the back was the wrong way around... so this means it doesn't rule out the brockage - or confirms it? Your square 5p is interesting, my theory is that as they fed the srip of metal into cutting machine and cut it to the right size, then fed it into the stamping machine, it for some reason failed to stamp out the blank and it was struck in it's odd square state. It's a miracle it got through quality control (or maybe it did and a sneaky mint worker took a bag of dodgy ones home instead of to the melting pot ) You guys can be really slow sometimes...The other side is seen in a mirror, mirrors alway show things in reverse hence the writing is reversed. Where's that shaking head sadly emoticon when you need it. I didn't see the picture... and I was quoting you on the "written backwards" bit. If you're referring to "a brockage should have the reverse facing the right way in the mirror image" he was referring to the terminology for the tails side of the coin. Or am I being slow again? The coin has two heads so I couldn't call the image in the mirror it's reverse without complicating things. Anyway if it was a brockage the reflection would read correctly in the mirror.

err no supprises, want to check the 164A again. Although supposedly not as rare as the open 3 and 1909 I would suggest easily the most hardest of the Edward VII pennies, probably less than 20 known.

"the writing on the back is writen backwards. " Gary said that the back was the wrong way around... so this means it doesn't rule out the brockage - or confirms it? Your square 5p is interesting, my theory is that as they fed the srip of metal into cutting machine and cut it to the right size, then fed it into the stamping machine, it for some reason failed to stamp out the blank and it was struck in it's odd square state. It's a miracle it got through quality control (or maybe it did and a sneaky mint worker took a bag of dodgy ones home instead of to the melting pot ) You guys can be really slow sometimes...The other side is seen in a mirror, mirrors alway show things in reverse hence the writing is reversed. Where's that shaking head sadly emoticon when you need it.