Rob

Anyone with any ideas on this? Given the anomalies and the hefty price tag likely, I thought there might be some interest.

Thank you Paul for your kind comments. One thing I have always believed in is to sell a coin on the same basis as you assessed it when you bought it. I don't particularly care what someone calls a coin as it may or may not be in agreement with my own view. I just try not to move the goalposts. Accuracy and consistency are probably helped if you have emotional attributes of a brick. Society today virtually demands that the populace be nannied and controlled. Everyone has to have empathy with everything else. Laws are continually passed to regulate our behaviour because we are unable (apparently) to do this responsibly ourselves. In a little outpost of the universe called numismatics, we find that some people are brainwashed into insisting that only the views of an anonymous person or two (graders) who say that a coin is so and so good, count. To overcome any residual doubts we may have, an independent body says 'Hey, it really is that good'. The basic problem is one of personal inadequacy, whether perceived or real and the human desire to be loved/thought highly of in which an individual doesn't take a decision for fear of being wrong or being disliked, whether it be buying a coin in this case, or any number of situations that have hit the news over the years. Think major cockups and subsequent resignations after a healthy payout has been negotiated, brushing ineffectual leadership under the carpet etc, where a new broom taking over means that nobody is really held accountable and nothing changes at the coal face. Grade inflation is not only a problem of the unscupulous dealer or lenient grader, but also a problem of the individual who wants to own something that may not be easily achievable, and so we get 'for issue' appended to the grade. If everybody wants a mint state or uncirculated coin, then the market will adjust the grades to satisfy the demand by continuing to call an increasing level of wear mint state, such as MS60 on the Sheldon scale, which may not be as good as a British EF. It has long been obvious that the only way to get eyeballs to view a lot on eBay is to call something uncirculated. It is also obvious that an awful lot of people believe in what is said. Sellers are simply pandering to buyers' wishes. Rant to be continued.....

'And remember that all equally graded coins are not equal. What we really need is for CGS to form a relationship with WINGS so we can be sure that we're buying a coin we like. That CGS 85 just ain't doing it for me unless it's got a WINGS sticker on it mate. No.' What we really need to do is get people to connect their brain with their eyes and heart, then there won't be any doubt that we are buying a coin that we like. I get the impression that a significant number of people are buying a coin that they have been told they will/must like. Not the same thing.

Me too. So now I'm sitting on the Naughty Step. Wearing a plastic case of course I would have thought plastic mac to be more appropriate. I can think of quite a few naughty steps across the world where you would be very popular with this attire.

I can see that a dealer would accept a return within say 7 or 14 days if the customer is not happy and you will struggle to find a dealer who wouldn't, but it is an entirely different matter if the return depends on whether a TPG will slab something because they are not infrequently a loose cannon when it comes to grading or rejecting, though CGS are better than the US companies for British Coins. Bottom line is that if you want a coin in a CGS slab you can always buy it through their list as you will cut out the uncertainty.

I haven't slabbed a coin with them, but couldn't resist the temptation to look, despite your instructions. I would like to congratulate them on providing the easiest slab to open of all the TPGs, thus reducing the risk of damage to the coin.

I'm surprised nobody raised the question of the two 1860/59 pennies in this sale. One has an inverted die axis while the other is conventional. The inverted one is cleaned, the normal one is quite a good example with only the barest friction to a few high points, and by that I do mean only a trace of wear. The inverted one raises a few questions, not least, why does it exist? The reverse also has Britannia with an unusually full right breast as this is normally quite flat. The colons are a different size and the legend at BRITANNIAR is somewhat spindlier on one compared to the other. The earhole is a bit different. The obverse beads are a little bulkier. The obverse legend is thicker on the inverted one. There is a raised dot below the ear on the inverted one which is not on the normal one. If this is a rust spot then the inverted one must be later. The second fillet has a pair of parallel lines whereas the normal one doesn't. Not sure what to think other than it seems a little odd and flags up a potential problem. Are all these struck from the same die pair as far as is known? The two examples in this sale would appear not to be.

With it being a no WW coin found only on coins dated 1858 to 1860, there shouldn't be any underlying digit for an overdate. Any apparent overstrike will be a deeper punch cut slightly off centre to the initial one. Dies frequently had their legend and/or date reinforced when they became blocked through prolonged use. If a hardened die was repaired in this fashion, the repair is usually seen slightly displaced as the metal will be more difficult to work. Also, there is a relatively small chance the same punch will be used for the repair as was used to cut the die in the first place, so it may well have slightly different dimensions to the original. Not a variety in my opinion as it is just normal wear and tear.

I think the centre ground of English politics, which accounts for the majority of non-affiliated voters, will by and large move to ensure that neither side has more than a short term monopoly on power. Blair was a reaction to Thatcherism, Cameron is a reaction to Brown's/Balls economic mismanagement. In an ideal world you would give politicians the position but no power as they are rarely capable of using it responsibly for the masses, preferring to pander to their own supporters.

One might think that would be true, but apparently it isn't. Here's some analysis I found: The belief that Scottish independence would consign the rest of the UK to permanent Conservative government is one that inspires hope among Tories and despair among Labour. But both overestimate the influence of Scotland on general elections. On no occasion since 1945 would independence have changed the identity of the winning party and on only two occasions would it have converted a Labour majority into a hung parliament (1964 and October 1974). Without Scotland, Labour would still have won in 1945 (with a majority of 143, down from 146), in 1966 (75, down from 98), in 1997 (137, down from 179), in 2001 (127, down from 166) and in 2005 (43, down from 66). I think the demise of Labour governments is just wishful thinking. I would expect the prospect of more Tory governments to squeeze the Lib-Dems, who are essentially left of centre anyway and merge their votes with Labour.

<cough> I did once... But it was long time ago... And i almost forgot about it... I was referring to the grade/price combined with the problems. As we all know not all fines, VFs EFs or UNCs are equal.

You get a vote to leave the UK in November. I thought you had already done that? Rob, We left The UK in July...not November! LOL! Our General Election is in November. When does the Scotland vote take place? September 18th. Personally, I'm not too fussed which ever way it turns out. If Scotland decides to go it alone, then they will have to be treated as any other small foreign country. I think they are doing something for dogmatic rather than practical reasons. I take the view that the status quo is not worth changing unless you have a demonstrable improvement (say 10% or more) in profitability, living standards or whatever. The upheaval isn't worth a marginal increase, and if even that is in doubt then you should leave well alone. On the plus side, an independent Scotland will be self-sufficient in food for certain as Salmond has a large enough chip on his shoulder to feed the world - that's if he can overcome his own ego.

You get a vote to leave the UK in November. I thought you had already done that?

They certainly shouldn't have any say in matters relating to the separation if the vote is in favour as that is akin to someone writing the terms of their own redundancy i.e a golden handshake. You only give these when you want to be rid of someone - something that Parliament has never demanded.

If they vote to leave, how soon do the Scottish MPs get kicked out of Parliament? Anyone know? It would certainly be unacceptable for them to have any say in this country's politics forthwith if they effectively represent a foreign entity. i.e. they should be as welcome as a politician from Brussels, but with absolutely no influence. Maybe the best thing is to float Scotland adrift, after all, we already have relatively little say on what goes on in Scotland, yet spend money regardless (despite Scottish MPs being allowed to vote on matters affecting England only).

Fine to good fine with problems. Spink quote Fine at £85, but I would be amazed if anyone would pay that much. £30-40? simply because most are better than this. Has it been mounted previously? And you have front and back reversed. By convention, the obverse (front) is the side with the monarch's head on it, or if without a portriat, the side displaying the titles of the person in whose name it was struck.

At least you have some means of operation with a choice of 4 gadgets whereas you're b*******d if the iPhone attacks the person on the other end and gets put in the naughty bin. Cunning things these iPhones, after all, you only have to look at the subliminal messages Dave's phone sends out. Wouldn't trust 'em an inch.

I think Mrs Rob got it right (as usual). For a couple of years they spent nothing on the team, but Ferguson being the motivator he is enabled the tanks to run on empty for a while. Once he had left, the pressure was off as the players felt able to take their foot off the gas and have a breather. They had already won the trophies, so chasing titles was not as big an inspiration as it would be with a hungry team that was still trying for success. Without a manager able to motivate to the level of Ferguson, the only way was down.

Don't worry about not fitting in. I'm odd as those who know me will vouch, but have lasted over 9 years so far.

I would think so, as it mimics the shoulder detail of G2 silver with the cuirassed bust.

brilliant

No idea, but I have never looked for it as a variety. It really depends on whether it is an inverted V or a filled die as obviously the latter is a normal event as opposed to an error. A lot of these spurious 'errors' are unwarranted IMO as they tend to exist in varying developmental stages, so are clearly not by design. The pricing in Coincraft suggests not rare as it is priced cheaper than the 1746 LIMA shilling and only marginally more than the barred 1745.

As a non-conformist, I like things which don't obey the normal rules such as the below which has a ↑→ die axis. The reverse shields are wrong for 3 of the 4, as only the French one is in the correct position. This is a useful piece as one might infer that the dies were normally aligned in the press by matching the top of the bust with the French shield.

Everything was en-medaille (upright die axis) from the Jubilee Head issues of 1887 onwards. From 1787 to 1887 there was a mixture, with some upright and others inverted (en-coin). Before 1787, an inverted die axis was the norm, though the odd example with an upright axis exists such as the 1663 first bust shilling.

I concur with the first sentence but not the second. True you see lots of comparable pieces that are graded miles apart, but this is a benefit of the system as it means you can pick up coins which have been undergraded very cheaply indeed, being as they are by extension, undesirable, having the wrong label or number. This is a bonus, not a shortfall and should be milked for all it is worth.