How do you make a collage or overlay images?

[Rob]

Somebody give me a clue please. I'm trying to make a collage of coin images which are superimposed so as to resemble a pile of coins. I am unwilling to physically pile them on top of each other for obvious reasons. I don't seem able to draw a freehand outline in paint to crop, copy and paste, which seems to be about the only suitable program you get with Microsoft. I also can't work out how to cut out a circle and save it as such without taking the basic square or rectangle and manually filling in the bits I don't want with white, but it always keeps the original dimensions even after saving. Not a good day.

Yours, frustrated, confused and completely in the dark. Thanks.

[Nick]

Somebody give me a clue please. I'm trying to make a collage of coin images which are superimposed so as to resemble a pile of coins. I am unwilling to physically pile them on top of each other for obvious reasons. I don't seem able to draw a freehand outline in paint to crop, copy and paste, which seems to be about the only suitable program you get with Microsoft. I also can't work out how to cut out a circle and save it as such without taking the basic square or rectangle and manually filling in the bits I don't want with white, but it always keeps the original dimensions even after saving. Not a good day.

Yours, frustrated, confused and completely in the dark. Thanks.

As you have found out, it isn't a straightforward task. You will need a more capable program than Microsoft Paint. As a minimum, you'll need the ability to select circular regions, but the best way is to use layers and transparency masks. To do this you'll need a software package like Photoshop or Paintshop Pro, which you may be able to download a time-limited trial version from the Internet.

However, even when you have the necessary tools, a fair amount of practice (and trial and error) is required to produce a suitable result.

Edited October 18, 2012 by Nick

[davidrj]

To do this you'll need a software package like Photoshop or Paintshop Pro, which you may be able to download a time-limited trial version from the Internet.

However, even when you have the necessary tools, a fair amount of practice (and trial and error) is required to produce a suitable result.

Photoscape is free and has a circular crop tool

[declanwmagee]

Serif Photoplus Starter Edition

another freebie with a circular crop...

[Debbie]

If you have Publisher you can use the transparency icon in the tool bar to get rid of the "square white background" It looks like this

[Coinery]

If I can do something for you Rob, it would be my pleasure! I'll email you later!

[azda]

Personally i use Da Vinci, an old mate, did a few bits and pieces here and there, and the boy could draw a complete 360 degree circle freehand apparently.........

[azda]

To do this you'll need a software package like Photoshop or Paintshop Pro, which you may be able to download a time-limited trial version from the Internet.

However, even when you have the necessary tools, a fair amount of practice (and trial and error) is required to produce a suitable result.

Photoscape is free and has a circular crop tool

In one fell swoop David took out Nick, the old Eagle soars high above his prey Christ, i'm beginning to sound like Peter and his Cubans and wine (hic)

[Peter]

Dave

Don't give me a bad reputation.

I enjoy good food/wine/women(only the one since 1986....I did have a few temptations but never been unfaithfull)

[Rob]

Thanks chaps. Coinery to the rescue.

[Rob]

Sorry folks, this has raised its head again with a twist. A slightly different problem. I have a die which I know is recut from another, which in itself is also a recut die as at least two stages of recutting are seen which tie in with two known dies known to be earlier. I need to be able to superimpose one, or possibly more than one on the other and make the top layers transparent in order to align the various features. The problem is exacerbated by one coin being struck on a faulty rocker press which slips in operation leading to a 10-15% distortion along one axis. So the basic requirements are a program that allows you to stretch or compress along one axis or both and to overlay images.

I had a look at the Photoscape link and that is dead. I'm not sure if I have publisher, but presume not. Photoshop costs £389 which I'm not willing to pay, and in any case appears to be Adobe. Paintshop is Corel. I guess I need a microsoft program because that's what my computer uses for its operating software and I don't want any problems with compatibility. Looking for Microsoft image overlay program in google wasn't very helpful.

Thanks.

[Nick]

Sorry folks, this has raised its head again with a twist. A slightly different problem. I have a die which I know is recut from another, which in itself is also a recut die as at least two stages of recutting are seen which tie in with two known dies known to be earlier. I need to be able to superimpose one, or possibly more than one on the other and make the top layers transparent in order to align the various features. The problem is exacerbated by one coin being struck on a faulty rocker press which slips in operation leading to a 10-15% distortion along one axis. So the basic requirements are a program that allows you to stretch or compress along one axis or both and to overlay images.

I had a look at the Photoscape link and that is dead. I'm not sure if I have publisher, but presume not. Photoshop costs £389 which I'm not willing to pay, and in any case appears to be Adobe. Paintshop is Corel. I guess I need a microsoft program because that's what my computer uses for its operating software and I don't want any problems with compatibility. Looking for Microsoft image overlay program in google wasn't very helpful.

Thanks.

Overlaying images with transparency is easy enough, most sensible image processing software packages will be able to do that. However, finding a package to negate the distortion might be more challenging. Can you post a picture and explain what you want doing? Then we might be able to have a bash with whatever packages we have available...

[Coinery]

Sorry folks, this has raised its head again with a twist. A slightly different problem. I have a die which I know is recut from another, which in itself is also a recut die as at least two stages of recutting are seen which tie in with two known dies known to be earlier. I need to be able to superimpose one, or possibly more than one on the other and make the top layers transparent in order to align the various features. The problem is exacerbated by one coin being struck on a faulty rocker press which slips in operation leading to a 10-15% distortion along one axis. So the basic requirements are a program that allows you to stretch or compress along one axis or both and to overlay images.

I had a look at the Photoscape link and that is dead. I'm not sure if I have publisher, but presume not. Photoshop costs £389 which I'm not willing to pay, and in any case appears to be Adobe. Paintshop is Corel. I guess I need a microsoft program because that's what my computer uses for its operating software and I don't want any problems with compatibility. Looking for Microsoft image overlay program in google wasn't very helpful.

Thanks.

Overlaying images with transparency is easy enough, most sensible image processing software packages will be able to do that. However, finding a package to negate the distortion might be more challenging. Can you post a picture and explain what you want doing? Then we might be able to have a bash with whatever packages we have available...

Yes, I'm sorry, Rob, I too meant to reply but...

A quick post of the 'good' die and the 'stretched' one would clarify what you're after, and what the possibilities are. With transparency overlays, the difficult part is seeing the differences without repeatedly moving the images on and off each other, which you might need the software it was created on to do??????

Once we can see your needs, it might?? be possible to set the whole thing up with a bit of software, and then send you the exported images separately in their transparent forms...I think that might??? work????

The software I use, took me about 2 days of playing with to understand the basic functions, thereafter there's an infinite amount of time you could spend! However, I only ever learn that which is needed for my own purpose...same with the camera, a very capable piece of kit that does only 1/2 % of what it's capable of, but it's only the 1/2% I'm interested in!

[Rob]

Attached is the Chester halfcrown with CHST below from the Spink catalogue. As you can see, coin was made on a rocker press showing elongation along one axis which is a feature of the coining method. However, in the case of this issue, the rocker press used was defective, appearing to slip on the obverse to the extent that the dimensions of the inner circle are 29mm top to bottom and 33.5mm left to right. The distortion is clearly on one side only as the I of HIR is about 1.5mm taller than the I of CHRISTO. As the dies will have been made from the same punches at the same time, the distortion on the left hand side is clearest with the letter R. If you use paint you can compress the left side to produce a roughly circular inner circle and sensible letters. All CHST obverses are missing the RHS of the legend, so the obverse die must be travelling through the press at a slower rate than the reverse die. So far so good, but Paint doesn't do overlays with transparency as far as I can make out. I'm trying to establish which die this was in its previous existence which is where the overlays come in. This can also be applied to the declaration issue where I have made far more progress and know both engraver and previous dies due to the greater amount of plain field present. The quantity of detail on the average obverse makes overlaying sheets of A4 a bit difficult, hence the request.

Edited November 15, 2012 by Rob

[Rob]

Sorry, let's get that the right way up!

Sod it. Too big. How can a 147K image become 203K when inverted? anyway, you know what I mean from the image.

[Peckris]

Don't buy Photoshop, buy Elements, which is 80% of the software for less than £100.

[Nick]

Attached is the Chester halfcrown with CHST below from the Spink catalogue. As you can see, coin was made on a rocker press showing elongation along one axis which is a feature of the coining method. However, in the case of this issue, the rocker press used was defective, appearing to slip on the obverse to the extent that the dimensions of the inner circle are 29mm top to bottom and 33.5mm left to right. The distortion is clearly on one side only as the I of HIR is about 1.5mm taller than the I of CHRISTO. As the dies will have been made from the same punches at the same time, the distortion on the left hand side is clearest with the letter R. If you use paint you can compress the left side to produce a roughly circular inner circle and sensible letters. All CHST obverses are missing the RHS of the legend, so the obverse die must be travelling through the press at a slower rate than the reverse die. So far so good, but Paint doesn't do overlays with transparency as far as I can make out. I'm trying to establish which die this was in its previous existence which is where the overlays come in. This can also be applied to the declaration issue where I have made far more progress and know both engraver and previous dies due to the greater amount of plain field present. The quantity of detail on the average obverse makes overlaying sheets of A4 a bit difficult, hence the request.

As a quick and dirty experiment, I used Paint Shop Pro to deform the picture such that the inner ring of beads looks roughly circular. Any use to you? Paint Shop Pro also handles layers and transparency.

[Rob]

It does that in paint too, just the image is over 1Mb so can't post easily. It is a case of adjusting the images and overlaying that I need. The level of distortion varies from coin to coin, so I want to be able to overlay images and then adjust the LHS for example of the variable one until they are superimposed. Is that asking too much of any program out there?

Edited November 15, 2012 by Rob

[Nick]

It does that in paint too, just the image is over 1Mb so can't post easily. It is a case of adjusting the images and overlaying that I need. The level of distortion varies from coin to coin, so I want to be able to overlay images and then adjust the LHS for example of the variable one until they are superimposed. Is that asking too much of any program out there?

It's not asking too much of any program, but it would certainly take some time to adjust each of the layers to ensure that the sizes and rotations are compatible once the distortion has been adjusted.

[Rob]

It does that in paint too, just the image is over 1Mb so can't post easily. It is a case of adjusting the images and overlaying that I need. The level of distortion varies from coin to coin, so I want to be able to overlay images and then adjust the LHS for example of the variable one until they are superimposed. Is that asking too much of any program out there?

It's not asking too much of any program, but it would certainly take some time to adjust each of the layers to ensure that the sizes and rotations are compatible once the distortion has been adjusted.

Checking for distortion is easy enough. If you have two coins from the same die which overlay exactly, then there is no distortion. This then becomes the 'standard' against which you compare the variable one. It is just a problem for the first three Chester halfcrowns, as the kit seems to have been either repaired or replaced by the time that the 3 pellets obverse die was introduced.

Edited November 16, 2012 by Rob