English Silver Coins

[Andrewlincs]

Ok, so I'm new to coins and this may well be a silly question.

I understand the silver content of our coins was reduced during 1920.

Is there a way to tell the different silver content coins issued during 1920?

Thanks

Andrew

[Peckris]

Ok, so I'm new to coins and this may well be a silly question.

I understand the silver content of our coins was reduced during 1920.

Is there a way to tell the different silver content coins issued during 1920?

Thanks

Andrew

Actually, apart from a very rare example, all coins dated 1920 are 50% silver, i.e. a new alloy. It's PRE-1920 that they are sterling (92.5%) silver. The 50% silver lasted until 1946, then since 1947 all "silver" coins have been an alloy of copper and nickel.

[Andrewlincs]

Thanks for the reply, that certainly clarifies the situation and answers my question.

Regards

Andrew

[Nick]

Ok, so I'm new to coins and this may well be a silly question.

I understand the silver content of our coins was reduced during 1920.

Is there a way to tell the different silver content coins issued during 1920?

Thanks

Andrew

Actually, apart from a very rare example, all coins dated 1920 are 50% silver, i.e. a new alloy. It's PRE-1920 that they are sterling (92.5%) silver. The 50% silver lasted until 1946, then since 1947 all "silver" coins have been an alloy of copper and nickel.

That's not quite true. There are 1920 sixpences and threepences of .925 and .500 silver. The easiest way to tell them apart is to let them fall (gently) on a hard surface and listen to the resulting sound. Then compare with a 1919 version (.925) and also with a 1921 (.500). To my ear the .925 is quite a sharp sound, whereas the .500 is a bit duller.

[Peckris]

Ok, so I'm new to coins and this may well be a silly question.

I understand the silver content of our coins was reduced during 1920.

Is there a way to tell the different silver content coins issued during 1920?

Thanks

Andrew

Actually, apart from a very rare example, all coins dated 1920 are 50% silver, i.e. a new alloy. It's PRE-1920 that they are sterling (92.5%) silver. The 50% silver lasted until 1946, then since 1947 all "silver" coins have been an alloy of copper and nickel.

That's not quite true. There are 1920 sixpences and threepences of .925 and .500 silver. The easiest way to tell them apart is to let them fall (gently) on a hard surface and listen to the resulting sound. Then compare with a 1919 version (.925) and also with a 1921 (.500). To my ear the .925 is quite a sharp sound, whereas the .500 is a bit duller.

You learn something new...

[azda]

Nicks statement is correct, some coins issued during 1920 were also .925 silver and others .500, but i won't be dropping any i have to check. There must be another way to test the silver content during the 20s? Anyone?

[Gary D]

Nicks statement is correct, some coins issued during 1920 were also .925 silver and others .500, but i won't be dropping any i have to check. There must be another way to test the silver content during the 20s? Anyone?

Picture me tossing my 1935 proof crown trying to determine if it's the 0.500 or 0.925 silver content

Saying that it's the only way I know how to tell the difference apart from chemically which you really don't want to do to your prized coins. Buy the way the ring is low for 0.925 and high for 0.500, not as previously stated.

[Nick]

Nicks statement is correct, some coins issued during 1920 were also .925 silver and others .500, but i won't be dropping any i have to check. There must be another way to test the silver content during the 20s? Anyone?

I wasn't suggesting you drop them from a great height. A millimetre or two above a work surface is sufficient and does no damage to small coins with little weight.

[Nick]

Nicks statement is correct, some coins issued during 1920 were also .925 silver and others .500, but i won't be dropping any i have to check. There must be another way to test the silver content during the 20s? Anyone?

Picture me tossing my 1935 proof crown trying to determine if it's the 0.500 or 0.925 silver content

Saying that it's the only way I know how to tell the difference apart from chemically which you really don't want to do to your prized coins. Buy the way the ring is low for 0.925 and high for 0.500, not as previously stated.

That's what it says in Davies book, but that's not the way I hear it. Comparing the sounds with 1919 and 1921 versions is a surefire way to discriminate the two types, however it sounds to the individual.

[Gary D]

Nicks statement is correct, some coins issued during 1920 were also .925 silver and others .500, but i won't be dropping any i have to check. There must be another way to test the silver content during the 20s? Anyone?

Picture me tossing my 1935 proof crown trying to determine if it's the 0.500 or 0.925 silver content

Saying that it's the only way I know how to tell the difference apart from chemically which you really don't want to do to your prized coins. Buy the way the ring is low for 0.925 and high for 0.500, not as previously stated.

That's what it says in Davies book, but that's not the way I hear it. Comparing the sounds with 1919 and 1921 versions is a surefire way to discriminate the two types, however it sounds to the individual.

My engineering background tells me that silver is softer than a alloy of silver and copper etc. The softer the material the lower the ring for two items of a similar size. Gold would ring even lower and lead lower still if you could get it to ring at all.

[Peckris]

Nicks statement is correct, some coins issued during 1920 were also .925 silver and others .500, but i won't be dropping any i have to check. There must be another way to test the silver content during the 20s? Anyone?

My thoughts :

1. There is no added numismatic value for the sixpences and threepences depending on silver content - they aren't even mentioned in catalogues and price lists. Therefore the difference between the two types won't be a factor in any grade above Fine (and below that they aren't worth collecting).

2. Therefore the only time it's important is when you want bullion value from worn coins. I would have thought that at that stage, there would be quite a difference in colour between the two? After all, the Mint got the first attempt at the new alloy badly wrong, and 50%-silver coins of 1920 and 1921 get discoloured and ugly. I realise that's not a scientific test, but it could help.

But, I'm kind of wondering what profit there might be in cornering the market in worn 1920 6d's and 3d's, in order to cash in on the tiny difference in bullion value with coins that small. It seems to me that the costs incurred in trying out a definitive test would negate most of the profit? The words "worth" "trouble" "more" "it's" & "than" come to mind.

[Peter]

Nicks statement is correct, some coins issued during 1920 were also .925 silver and others .500, but i won't be dropping any i have to check. There must be another way to test the silver content during the 20s? Anyone?

My thoughts :

1. There is no added numismatic value for the sixpences and threepences depending on silver content - they aren't even mentioned in catalogues and price lists. Therefore the difference between the two types won't be a factor in any grade above Fine (and below that they aren't worth collecting).

2. Therefore the only time it's important is when you want bullion value from worn coins. I would have thought that at that stage, there would be quite a difference in colour between the two? After all, the Mint got the first attempt at the new alloy badly wrong, and 50%-silver coins of 1920 and 1921 get discoloured and ugly. I realise that's not a scientific test, but it could help.

But, I'm kind of wondering what profit there might be in cornering the market in worn 1920 6d's and 3d's, in order to cash in on the tiny difference in bullion value with coins that small. It seems to me that the costs incurred in trying out a definitive test would negate most of the profit? The words "worth" "trouble" "more" "it's" & "than" come to mind.

Yep...100 of the more silver blighters will be worth approx £20 more...thats 20p for a different ding...oh damn which pile did I put that one in. I would be bored after 5 dings and the rest go in the pre 47 pile.

[Andrewlincs]

Interesting, I did wonder if the different alloy after 1920 would have different electrical properties that might be measured. If I could find my multi meter I'd give it a try...

Regarding the scrap value, I assumed that at 1.4 grams per coin it would be 20 3d's to an ounce, making each pre 1920 coin worth about £1 and post 1920 50% coins half that. Any comments appreciated.

Regards

Andrew

[Nick]

Interesting, I did wonder if the different alloy after 1920 would have different electrical properties that might be measured. If I could find my multi meter I'd give it a try...

Regarding the scrap value, I assumed that at 1.4 grams per coin it would be 20 3d's to an ounce, making each pre 1920 coin worth about £1 and post 1920 50% coins half that. Any comments appreciated.

Regards

Andrew

Quite possibly, but you would probably need very sensitive measuring equipment. I wonder if it would be easier to measure the thermal conductivity, which would also differ between the two types.

[josie]

In the past I did try to use a electrical tester,the results depends on how much pressure and distance to the circumference of the coin the results varies on how worn the coins,even search on the web on the conductibility but for the good results the conductor should be in rod or cylindrical in dimension same on wiring etc,in the past seen several movies using coins for conductibility and others uses of coins.

Most of the replies in testing silver is by sounds,others uses metal detector etc.

Edited September 3, 2011 by josie

[declanwmagee]

For those of us purist collectors, an easy test would be great so we could fill a gap, regardless of value. If there's two kinds, I've got to have both. It's pathological.

[Gary D]

For those of us purist collectors, an easy test would be great so we could fill a gap, regardless of value. If there's two kinds, I've got to have both. It's pathological.

I'm with declan, they are two difference coins so I need to be able to distinguish between them. I have wondered it you could lay the coin on a transducer and give it a frequency sweep to find the resonant frequency. It would be different for different size coins but it wouldn't take long to compile a table for the complete range of coins.

[Peter]

For those of us purist collectors, an easy test would be great so we could fill a gap, regardless of value. If there's two kinds, I've got to have both. It's pathological.

I'm with declan, they are two difference coins so I need to be able to distinguish between them. I have wondered it you could lay the coin on a transducer and give it a frequency sweep to find the resonant frequency. It would be different for different size coins but it wouldn't take long to compile a table for the complete range of coins.

I'm sure you would get a different beep with a metal detector.

[Red Riley]

Just let it fall from a few mm. onto a wooden table, it won't come to any harm.

[Peckris]

For those of us purist collectors, an easy test would be great so we could fill a gap, regardless of value. If there's two kinds, I've got to have both. It's pathological.

LOL. If one of them was much scarcer than the other, THEN I'd be interested - that's my pathology! (It's why 1937 micro-varieties leave me entirely cold)

[declanwmagee]

For those of us purist collectors, an easy test would be great so we could fill a gap, regardless of value. If there's two kinds, I've got to have both. It's pathological.

LOL. If one of them was much scarcer than the other, THEN I'd be interested - that's my pathology! (It's why 1937 micro-varieties leave me entirely cold)

As you can imagine, Mr Grooms excellent books left my approaching completeness 20th century decidedly holey.

As for 1937, I even had to get both brass 3ds. I did give up on the two Davies numbers for the silver 3d though. Anyone got a 1+B? Or seen one? GaryD?

[Gary D]

For those of us purist collectors, an easy test would be great so we could fill a gap, regardless of value. If there's two kinds, I've got to have both. It's pathological.

LOL. If one of them was much scarcer than the other, THEN I'd be interested - that's my pathology! (It's why 1937 micro-varieties leave me entirely cold)

As you can imagine, Mr Grooms excellent books left my approaching completeness 20th century decidedly holey.

As for 1937, I even had to get both brass 3ds. I did give up on the two Davies numbers for the silver 3d though. Anyone got a 1+B? Or seen one? GaryD?

No not seen one