Thick flan?

[absence of uniformity]

I dont have this Halfpenny coin to hand but noticed what looks to be possibly a thick flan would you agree or not? I appreciate its not so easy to be sure from the image provided.

[absence of uniformity]

A worn penny is measuring 1mm thick, proportionally this halfpenny looks thick to me.

I have measured the C in Victoria on a Halfpenny I have to hand using a vernier caliper the C seem's close to 2mm in height. 

Using the above image if I measure the C in Victoria then apply that to rim of the coin it appears similar thickness of roughly 2mm I know the image is on an angle which may change the accuracy of those measurments. It just looks thick to me.

The halfpenny coins I have measure around 1.2- 1.3mm thick. The imaged coin is clearly thicker than that.

What do you think?

Thanks

Edited Saturday at 09:33 AM by absence of uniformity

[absence of uniformity]

By measuring the top crossbar of the T on a coin I have to have it roughly 1.28-1.30mm if I measure the crossbar on the T on the above image then apply that measurement to the rim it suggest the Rim of the imaged coin is wider than 1.3mm.

[absence of uniformity]

The coin is 1874 H 10+J and I noticed this listed for 10+J : 1874H 10+J Thick flan R20

Edited Saturday at 10:57 AM by absence of uniformity

[absence of uniformity]

I just seen on LCA website there is a 1874 H Thick flan coin rated R20 listed as 2mm thick...

When comparing the imaged coin to the LCA example I cant see any differences in the die pairing.

The imaged coins is in alot better condition than the LCA coin which sold for £600. They state a EF example sold for £3042.

 

Edited Saturday at 11:19 AM by absence of uniformity

[absence of uniformity]

2 hours ago, absence of uniformity said:

I dont have this Halfpenny coin to hand but noticed what looks to be possibly a thick flan would you agree or not? I appreciate its not so easy to be sure from the image provided.

Just from this image alone would you not agree the flan thickness appears a similar width to the height to the C in Victoria? 

[Coinery]

No way you’re new to this, your language and approach is not elementary, it’s very weird! I know it’s not helpful or constructive to say this but I am really struggling, I can’t pitch you at all.

[absence of uniformity]

57 minutes ago, Coinery said:

No way you’re new to this, your language and approach is not elementary, it’s very weird! I know it’s not helpful or constructive to say this but I am really struggling, I can’t pitch you at all.

What are you talking about ? I found a coin online for sale that is a 1874 H which I have identified as 10+J ( I could be wrong) And it would appear it has has a thick rim. I'm simply asking the forum for advice.............. I dont understand these assumptions/accusations what's it all about? what is the problem. I'm asking a genuine question to the forum looking for advice and thoughts on my theory I have put forward. What is so mind boggling to you about this? The questions is really simple. Yes I have used my brain in producing this question why is that so alarming? 

Tell me what is weird? What's not elementary? pitch me? explain to me what you are getting at

Edited Saturday at 11:28 PM by absence of uniformity

[absence of uniformity]

Why should I constantly have to prove myself. You bought no value to this discussion instead you suggest im being dishonest.

Im really starting to find it rude. What is so hard to understand about asking a valid question? You have been quite supportive to my journey so far then suddenly you getting all weird.  

Edited Saturday at 11:54 PM by absence of uniformity

[absence of uniformity]

Do you resent me for putting in the legwork and finding the coins I have found?

You cant sit back overlook the coins then to make yourself feel better about it by start chucking around accusations.

I'm not weird for your shortcomings.

[Coinery]

You are just very unusual, that’s all, you have the language and insights of someone who has put years into understanding numismatics, not short months. You appear to have achieved a great deal of knowledge in a very short timeframe, it’s baffling…I’d take it as a compliment!

[Peckris 2]

15 hours ago, absence of uniformity said:

Why should I constantly have to prove myself. You bought no value to this discussion instead you suggest im being dishonest.

Im really starting to find it rude. What is so hard to understand about asking a valid question? You have been quite supportive to my journey so far then suddenly you getting all weird.  

I'd be very interested to learn the sources you used for the knowledge you've acquired? No accusations, I'm just genuinely interested!

[absence of uniformity]

On 5/10/2026 at 10:10 AM, Coinery said:

You are just very unusual, that’s all, you have the language and insights of someone who has put years into understanding numismatics, not short months. You appear to have achieved a great deal of knowledge in a very short timeframe, it’s baffling…I’d take it as a compliment!

In this post the one single numismatic term which I used is Flan.. The coin question is listed in black and white including the word flan.

I asked the seller of the coin "does the rim of the coin have damaged" In order to obtain images of the edge of the coin without raising suspicion. And that's it.

I dont even know for sure if the pairing is even 10+J. (So this could all be a complete waste of time) 

Richard's website lists the halfpenny types, the die pairings and the rarity rating so no knowledge is required. 

I have just noticed a coin which looks thick and by chance its possibly 10+J zero knowledge was required to reach this point. 

It was logical to measure the letters on a coin I have and then apply those measurements to the image IMO just basic pragmatic approach to my own question.

 

 

[absence of uniformity]

18 hours ago, Peckris 2 said:

I'd be very interested to learn the sources you used for the knowledge you've acquired? No accusations, I'm just genuinely interested!

What exactly are you referring to ? Im here asking a question which would suggest I dont have the "knowledge" I exclusively use Richard's website Michael Freemans book and the LCA website. Between those three sources of information the only detailed info availible I'm missing is from the other specialists. Have you noticed nearly all of my questions are not related to anything written by M Gouby........ Because I dont have access to any of it or Dracott etc. I use the info availible to me I dont retain any of the knowledge. Every single coin I look or come across I check it against the info I have availible to me. Its a question of Probability all thats seen here is the very few leads that actually have potential that I cant exclude myself as nothing. It really is as simple as that.  Im super intense with my research and efforts, as I have explained to you previously you get out what you put in. I was lucky enough to find a couple of super rare coins which gave me a huge boost of motivation. I dont really have much else to say about this.

 

[Coinery]

Business as usual, then! I still reserve the right to think you unusual, though. Keep going.

[absence of uniformity]

 

9 minutes ago, Coinery said:

Business as usual, then! I still reserve the right to think you unusual, though. Keep going.

That's fine, but do you think the coin/question of this post is unusual in terms of the apparent thickness. Nobody addressed it. Everyone wants to talk about knowledge or language. Does the appearance of the this halfpenny coin look thicker than normal using the limited info I have put forward. I purchased the coin so will find out sooner rather later anyway. I didnt want to ask the seller for a weight for obvious reason's. 

Edited 12 hours ago by absence of uniformity

[jelida]

55 minutes ago, absence of uniformity said:

 

That's fine, but do you think the coin/question of this post is unusual in terms of the apparent thickness. Nobody addressed it. Everyone wants to talk about knowledge or language. Does the appearance of the this halfpenny coin look thicker than normal using the limited info I have put forward. 

It really isn’t reasonable to expect us to influence decisions as to how you spend your money where the facts are not clear cut, and the perspective of other parties photographs is notoriously unreliable when making size or thickness estimations. Some you will get right and some wrong simply because the image does not reflect reality, but it has to be up to you whether to take the plunge. It’s great to hear of a successful rare find or new discovery when it is definite and in the hand and when correct weights and measurements and clear photos can be taken, but we don’t need to be party to your thought processes before the actual facts can be ascertained. And please don’t be so quick to take offence when it is largely not intended, which is in itself offensive and unhelpful.
The sources you quote are excellent, and with the addition of Gouby are exactly my primary sources. You are clearly a quick learner, but experience can only be gained over time , often by trial and error which is where you are at now.

Jerry

[absence of uniformity]

2 hours ago, jelida said:

It really isn’t reasonable to expect us to influence decisions as to how you spend your money where the facts are not clear cut, and the perspective of other parties photographs is notoriously unreliable when making size or thickness estimations. Some you will get right and some wrong simply because the image does not reflect reality, but it has to be up to you whether to take the plunge. It’s great to hear of a successful rare find or new discovery when it is definite and in the hand and when correct weights and measurements and clear photos can be taken, but we don’t need to be party to your thought processes before the actual facts can be ascertained. And please don’t be so quick to take offence when it is largely not intended, which is in itself offensive and unhelpful.
The sources you quote are excellent, and with the addition of Gouby are exactly my primary sources. You are clearly a quick learner, but experience can only be gained over time , often by trial and error which is where you are at now.

Jerry

The coin was purchased prior to posting here.. To save you being party to any of it il refrain from posting questions about my coins here. 

 

[Martinminerva]

On 5/9/2026 at 10:13 AM, absence of uniformity said:

but noticed what looks to be possibly a thick flan would you agree or not?

For what it's worth, I do not think this is a very rare thick flan 10+J but rather a normal flan one where the rim has been "rolled" in machinery and slightly compressed thus, and so makes the edge look wider. My evidence for this is

a) this was commonly done with many, many bronze predecimal coins, I guess as people were just playing around with lathes etc in workshops, and I personally have many such examples of all bronze denominations and several monarchs, and

b) from your photo, the rim itself next to the beads appears to be thin or non-existent, when in reality there should be a distinct rim edge surrounding the beads (see photo of obverse 10 below, taken from Richard's halfpenny website) which is basically where the rolled metal has gone from to form the "thicker" edge.

c) The genuine thick flan is R20 for rarity, so VERY few known indeed. Of course, that is not to say another one wouldn't ever turn up, but mathematically one is more likely to find further specimens in the R17-R18 bracket, as you proved with your 1877 narrow date.

7 hours ago, absence of uniformity said:

but do you think the coin/question of this post is unusual in terms of the apparent thickness. Nobody addressed it.

But of course, one can only be sure when in hand and can be weighed, measured etc. But if you ask opinions from vague photos, be prepared to get vague answers, or indeed an absence of answers in light of the absence of evidence!

I wish you luck with this purchase, just as you have had much luck already, but equally you must expect disappointments too... Also, give things a bit more time for feedback: you only posted on Saturday morning - I am replying Monday afternoon!

Edited 4 hours ago by Martinminerva

[absence of uniformity]

Thanks, please see the attached image to see the normal rim edge. No rolling or machined IMO.

Edited 40 minutes ago by absence of uniformity

[absence of uniformity]

Just now, absence of uniformity said:

See attached image to see the normal rim edge. No rolling or machined IMO.

Rim edge looks Identical to the image you attached and perfectly normal to me.

[absence of uniformity]

10 hours ago, jelida said:

It really isn’t reasonable to expect us to influence decisions as to how you spend your money where the facts are not clear cut, and the perspective of other parties photographs is notoriously unreliable when making size or thickness estimations. Some you will get right and some wrong simply because the image does not reflect reality, but it has to be up to you whether to take the plunge. It’s great to hear of a successful rare find or new discovery when it is definite and in the hand and when correct weights and measurements and clear photos can be taken, but we don’t need to be party to your thought processes before the actual facts can be ascertained. And please don’t be so quick to take offence when it is largely not intended, which is in itself offensive and unhelpful.
The sources you quote are excellent, and with the addition of Gouby are exactly my primary sources. You are clearly a quick learner, but experience can only be gained over time , often by trial and error which is where you are at now.

Jerry

I dont remember asking for financial advice or about purchasing this coin.. As I said it was purchased prior to posting. The coin was cheap enough its a fair buy just for a standard coin in the condition it is. I said I wont post here with questions about my coins so you dont feel party to or obliged to respond but thinking about it you could just scroll on by if you dont want to get involved or do not wish to participate.

 

Edited 28 minutes ago by absence of uniformity

[absence of uniformity]

Im just going about my quest looking for input on a theory I have put forward and like other posts I feel I have to prove or justify myself.

When all I have done and doing is just learning and asking a simple question; what do you think about this !

And instead here we are again with me having to justify/prove that I started collecting penny varieties in Jan. Why does it even matter? 

I would rather do without the indirect compliments and just stick to coins. 

Maybe il say this; lets keep it coin related and the question in hand and if you do not wish to get involved and or bothered by me or my question or whatever please just scroll past. 

[absence of uniformity]

To keep things more coin centric and on the subject in hand Im not going to get involved with anything else and it will avoid as said above me taking offence.

Edited just now by absence of uniformity