Gun money

[declan03]

Hi again.

I have this James II 1690 gun money coin which is not in great condition, but i am going to sell it and was wondering what sort of price ask for....if any!!

Is there supposed to be a month on all of these coins? I can only barely make out what looks like an inverted Feb. 

As always any advice is appreciated. 

[bagerap]

Last year I sold a February 1689 shilling for £10.00 and a March 1690 shilling for £24.50. Both were in a slightly rougher condition than yours. It's worth noting that gun money for March 1690 is some of the rarest and for a very specific reason. At the time we used two calendars, full unification with the Gregorian calendar not coming until 1752. The legal New Year began on March 25th, so any coin minted for March 1690 had a validity of just eight days.

[Michael-Roo]

 

Don't know if its any help but I paid 40-something quid for this half crown last year. 

 

 

[declan03]

Nice coin Michael. Kind of puts mine in the shade condition wise. I got carried away in an auction last year and ended up paying £20 for it. Very interesting story about these coins Bagerap, thanks, its something new i,ve learned today, well that and not to slander the other halfs cooking!! 

So can i deduct from your explanation its a March coin? It weighs app.5.5 grams, so a shilling?

[Michael-Roo]

 

Yours is a shilling.  XII above the crown and sceptres = 12 pence.

I can't quite make them out in your photo but the month of issue is indicated by the three letters below the crown and sceptres. You can see on my half crown (of thirty pence, hence XXX) the letters Oct.

Edited May 24, 2017 by Michael-Roo

[bagerap]

No, I think it unlikely that yours is March, but I'm trying to find my images of the one I sold last year to check.

[scott]

December, can make out the first 2 letters on mine. I cant read anything on that shilling though to help. there were different fonts and styles used for the months though.

 

 

Edited May 25, 2017 by scott

[Michael-Roo]

15 hours ago, Michael-Roo said:

 

 

Don't know if its any help but I paid 40-something quid for this half crown last year. 

 

 

But I should have added, I was lucky to get it for that price, I would expect it to sell for more.

[Ukstu]

I've a few gunmoney pieces. A half crown , shilling & sixpence. Paid £40 for the half crown early this year & £44 for the shilling quite a few year's ago. The sixpence is holed. Great story behind the creation of this token coinage. The first letter on yours declan looks like a J. June or July ? 

Edited May 25, 2017 by Ukstu
Added image

[Ukstu]

If you go on google and type "Gunmoney and the Limerick mint pdf"

You'll find a pdf by Gerard Rice. Its a good document for identifying which mint the coins where minted at which should be possible if you figure the month on your shilling . There was two mints one in Limerick & the other in Dublin. 

[declan03]

Hey now that you say that Stu and that i,ve seen your coins to compare, i can see the June staring me in the face with that J.

I,m off for a look at the pdf now and brush up my knowledge on gun money.

Thanks guys for all your help.

[Rob]

June or Jan? They look similar, but the letter font can differ at times. Need to be certain.

[Ukstu]

Your welcome. My gut reaction was June. It definitely looks like a four letter month i think.  Try looking at it with a jewellers loupe or magnifying glass. 

Edited May 25, 2017 by Ukstu
Mistake

[declan03]

Hi.

Final question on this, i,ve looked but cannot seem to find what the J R initials on the reverse of the coin is. Any ideas?

[Rob]

59 minutes ago, declan03 said:

Hi.

Final question on this, i,ve looked but cannot seem to find what the J R initials on the reverse of the coin is. Any ideas?

IACOBVS REX (JAMES KING)

[declan03]

11 hours ago, Rob said:

IACOBVS REX (JAMES KING)

Thanks Rob

[Zo Arms]

On 5/24/2017 at 1:56 PM, bagerap said:

Last year I sold a February 1689 shilling for £10.00 and a March 1690 shilling for £24.50. Both were in a slightly rougher condition than yours. It's worth noting that gun money for March 1690 is some of the rarest and for a very specific reason. At the time we used two calendars, full unification with the Gregorian calendar not coming until 1752. The legal New Year began on March 25th, so any coin minted for March 1690 had a validity of just eight days.

Picked this up on eBay just before Christmas. If it's the rare year and month, could it not be open to modern restrikes, etc. Does this one look right? It does feel fatter towards the centre.

[JLS]

13 hours ago, Zo Arms said:

Picked this up on eBay just before Christmas. If it's the rare year and month, could it not be open to modern restrikes, etc. Does this one look right? It does feel fatter towards the centre.

Looks nice despite all the usual striking defects, and the reverse scratches. I've never seen a convincing modern forgery of a gun money piece, they always look "too perfect" with nice fields, which is not something you'll find easily, if at all, in the series !

[Zo Arms]

8 hours ago, JLS said:

Looks nice despite all the usual striking defects, and the reverse scratches. I've never seen a convincing modern forgery of a gun money piece, they always look "too perfect" with nice fields, which is not something you'll find easily, if at all, in the series !

Thanks. Pleasing to know that it's not a copy. Paid just over £20 for it, so a bargain I think.