Colin G.

Blimey hello Guildy!!! Its Saddlers

Nigel, Do you have any images, there will undoubtedly be someone on here who will be able to give you an educated guess at its authenticity. I know there are some very good fakes out there, but they can usually be picked out. I know there is a very good site somewhere which details known fakes and identifying features, but I can't find the link at the moment. This may be more aimed at ancient coins, but I think they did cover other fakes.

"if it is no better than a washer" Love the quote Rob, one I will definitely use in the future

I think Sylvester has hit the nail on the head, there is a big risk that people (especially beginners) may mix the Sheldon scale with the CGS scale and get something completely different to what they expected. I know you could say it is a case of buyer beware, or study before you buy, but the risk must be increased by this move. Nigel your comment is exactly the issue CGS are concerened about, which is that their coins may not be holding value in the market due to the strict grading, and people buying by grade rather than studying the coin itself. I have to agree that the coins I have seen to date have been accurately graded (even quite harshly in some circumstances), but I thin some of the prices that they list their items at does seem unjustified. I have seen proof farthings with a £300 premium just because they are in a slab, whilst I can appreciate proofs may be an area where an inexperienced collector can make a costly mistake, that level of premium does appear unjustified and loses them some credibility. Nigel in relation to your concern, that is what any prudent investor would do in such a circumstance. If you can buy a coin graded harshly, release it, and then sell it on the open market as a grade higher, and get the respective price, whilst it may intitally appear underhand (hence your question I assume), the new owner is buying a coin not a designated grade, and if they are happy with their purchase at the price you have sold it for, you have done nothing wrong. Crossing the mark in my opinion is stating that a coin is a certain grade when it clearly does not achieve that grade. Grading is very subjective, so you will always get a slight difference of opinion. Just have a look at some of the posts on here referencing grading, opinions are always in the same ball park, but will undoubtedly differ. Welcome to the wonderful world of collecting coins:D

Azda, I have a page on my website about these pieces, and a list of the known die varieties and combinations. http://www.aboutfarthings.co.uk/Lauer%20Model%20Farthings.html Fascinating little pieces, but surprisingly cheap to obtain

The 1860 farthing with the inverted reverse is the toothed border variety, not the beaded border. From the image, it looks as though the reverse and obverse are the same way up, which is the correct orientation.

I have freed several coins over the past few years, and a few I have left in. I like to compare coins, and it is very difficult to do whilst they are in their tomb. I slab my own coins, but they can be opened at any time and the coin removed. I buy the blanks from Canada. It allows them to be presented well, and I know I can pass them to relatives to look at without worrying about finger marks. It is quite easy to do without damaging the coin, but a nervy experience at first!! I generally hacksaw off the title section, so that the label can be kept for provenance, and then use a 1/4" chisel in the now open end and twist. They do not break at the seams, but the plastic face breaks off.

Happy Birthday Tom!!

Thanks Josie!!

Nope, definitely a penny. A penny is normally around 19mm in diameter, a five pence piece is around 17.5mm in diameter. Bearing in mind that the penny above is a little clipped, it seems to be about the right diameter. Just checking!!!

Scott the easiest identifier is the tide in relation to the corner of the rock. They can be found artifically darkened a lot easier, but the light finish coins, are much scarcer, but this can only be confirmed on highly lustrous coins, because they generally tone down very similarly.

Now on site http://www.myfarthings.co.uk/victoriavh1897.html Something wrong with that link : "Safari can’t open the page “http://http://www.myfarthings.co.uk/victoriavh1897.html†" Too many http's I should think. James not bad!! They are tough to find, a bargain at that price

Showing my lack of hammered experience here, but that coin in comparison to the 5p looks a bit small for a penny, would it not be a halfpenny?

Yes definitely another standard 1860 farthing being passed as a mule

I would also be only too happy to vouch for Chris. And Peter there goes my chances of getting your farthings down the pan!!

or my page on them Hanover Tokens I have got a catalogue for these tokens, but there is very little information on rarity etc, but they can be picked up relatively cheap. Without the token in hand it would be impossible to give you a die combination because the varieties are generally identified by measurements in legends etc.

It was not so long ago we were all in the same position. Ask away.....this is one of the joys of the hobby, spreading knowledge

Scott has solved the puzzle, it is an 1858 because of the WW incuse, all 1838 farthings were WW raised. Many have a strage 5 with the vertical upright of the 5 missing which makes people think its a 3. Scott you are definitely getting to grip with this identifying, well done!!

Peter I agree

Hi, There are eight different varieties to this date, all in relation to the position of the H. Your example appears to be my Reverse type 7, where the H has been recut. 1881H farthings - <<click here

Unless I've not kept up with some of the rarer varieties, I'd say that all 20th Century currency farthings are easy to come by, bar two : The 2+A 1953 pairing (especially the proof) - the 1+B is quite easy The 1915 'TT', Obverse 1. I have no real idea of the relative scarcity of the 1953 2+A, but I do know the 1915 is exceptionally rare. It's when you get to the Victorian bun and copper series that it really gets interesting. The different TT obverses are applicable to 1914 and 1915, there is also the 1911 hollow neck/normal neck versions, and you could possibly include the 1917 bright/dark finish. Other than coins that escaped the artificial darkening that about sums it up for the 20th century farthings at the moment Isn't it 1918 with the bright/dark finish ? Ooops typo

Unless I've not kept up with some of the rarer varieties, I'd say that all 20th Century currency farthings are easy to come by, bar two : The 2+A 1953 pairing (especially the proof) - the 1+B is quite easy The 1915 'TT', Obverse 1. I have no real idea of the relative scarcity of the 1953 2+A, but I do know the 1915 is exceptionally rare. It's when you get to the Victorian bun and copper series that it really gets interesting. The different TT obverses are applicable to 1914 and 1915, there is also the 1911 hollow neck/normal neck versions, and you could possibly include the 1917 bright/dark finish. Other than coins that escaped the artificial darkening that about sums it up for the 20th century farthings at the moment

Welcome to the madhouse

Kronos, The question you have asked is a bit open ended. I don't think there will ever be a definitive list of farthing varieties. The main varieties that are "known" are captured within CCGB. My site goes into things a bit deeper, but many of the varieties are not "well known" varieties, and many would even question whether they are worth recording. My area of collecting is farthings, and I enjoy studying the lesser known varieties, and recording anomolies that I find. For me it shows the "human" aspect of coin production and the errors that can occur in this process. My site is constantly expanding, and it seems to be a never ending process It is a case of there still being plenty of areas still to be studied with these wonderful little coins, and in my opinion the more people involved the better. Feel free to contribute

Welcome to the forum, and a big hello from another metal detecting coin collector!!