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Sadly ‘yes’ Mike, I have definitely looked into 1797 ships. I have owned and logged 40 different varieties of 1797 ships paired with 10-leaf obverses, and a further 7 different ships paired with the 11-leaf obverse. I have taken digital microscope pictures, all to exactly the same scale (65x), for comparison. I have now sold all but 4 examples retained in my collection. Apart from the number of gun port differences there are also many distinct differences in positioning of flag, bowsprit, platform, sails and rigging, also size of ships, roughness of sea and angle of ship in the sea. I attach 8 examples to demonstrate some of the differences I found, reduced in size to meet the site 500Kb limit. Hope this helps!

I’m just sorting through a few Victorian pennies, with a view to thinning down the collection, and thought the following pictures may be of interest to variety collectors. They show 6 slightly different 1853 3/3 repairs. Top left is the exact same coin pictured on MG’s website, which he calls Date Style C (?):- 1853 Copper penny 3 date styles (michael-coins.co.uk) Bottom left is the closer DEF colon (Peck 1503). I have owned 12 examples of this type over the years, and noted that they always show exact the same obverse / reverse legend features…… indicating that the closer DEF colon is only found on a single die pairing. The fact that I have 6 different 3/3’s, all with Date Style C (Plain 5), I think demonstrates the difficulty that would be encountered if one ever tried to re-catalogue all the minor sub-varieties that are found in this copper series.

I remember as a teenager, in the village I grew up in, peer pressure forced you to choose between Beatles and Stones..........couldn't be both..........a tricky one!

Well spotted Pete, the lighhouse is thinner, especially the top section..........and the sea does not cross the linear circle!

Bye bye happiness, Hello loneliness I think I'm gonna cry

The fact that the 5 is an exact match (apart from blocking) + the distances to both the sea and linear circle (which place the dot in the correct position) make me think that it is an example of the cannon ball. If the tooth on the better example had been flattened through wear then the horizontal red line would also meet at the same point as the lower grade (worn) piece. Here's another shot of the cannon ball on the worn piece, which I think is a little more convincing. The overhead shot with the digital microscope, used to get the measurements, has light reflection and makes the actual dot less convincing. I think this is a cannon ball penny, but guess we will see whether Richard agrees!

Agree, great find. Is there something going on at lhs of numeral 6 on the 1863?

Hi Jerry, I've had time to knock this out this evening with the superimposed images you requested.........good idea! Actual pictures of both 1875 'Cannon Ball' coins are at the left hand and right hand ends, both shot at the exact same 100x magnification, and identically positioned. The unusual (italic looking) 5 picture has then been over-laid onto the normal 5 picture. Looking from right to left, it has then been gradually removed, 10% at a time, using the software transparency feature.................to slowly reveal the normal 5 underneath. As you suspected, it is pretty convincing that the unusual looking 5 is NOT an altered die......... even though at first sight it would seem to be so. I guess it is just a late strike of this variety, with part of the top of the 5 now blocked out. Hope the pictures are clear enough; I had to resize to stick within the 500K limit!!

No problem Jerry, but will be a few days before I get a chance now.

....and here's the numeral 5 on the better cannon ball for comparison to the repaired example

Re. your 'must be a single die variety' comment Jerry, I have just taken digital microscope shots of this low grade Cannon Ball (with repaired 5) and compared to my higher grade example (no repaired 5) to attempt to pinpoint the dot in relation to a) the sea level and b) the linear circle. Whilst the border teeth are flatter on the more worn (repaired 5) example it does seem to me that the cannon ball fits in well with the expected location.....and must be bona fide.

I think it looks like top part of another 'higher' 5 Blake, but then there is no other part of an underneath 5 protruding elsewhere which I guess I would have expected to see e.g. like this 1862/2

Apologies for my earlier typo, I should of course have said reverse k (not L).

Does your Cannon Ball have the repaired 5 Blake.... same question for Jerry x 3?

Links to the two LCA pieces Richard:- Penny 1875 as Freeman 80 dies 8+H but with a raised dot below the fi : A154 L2439 : Auction Prices (londoncoins.co.uk) Penny 1875 as Freeman 80 dies 8+H but with a raised dot below the fi : A152 L2425 : Auction Prices (londoncoins.co.uk)

Well spotted yourself Pete. I too saw that the 5 looked a bit strange, made me question whether the cannon ball was present because didn't think other cannon ball examples had anything going on with the 5. Anyway, here is a close-up to put you out of your misery.

Yes, I saw you had 3 out of only 7 documented specimens to date, well done...... must drive you dotty!

Poor grade, but found this 1875Ce (Cannon Ball) on ebay the other day. I noticed looking at latest MG page 68 that he still has the other type of 1875 with a dot (i.e. under the first I of VICTORIA) down as a Cd, with same obverse (his L) as the cannon ball. However, the only coins I have seen with dot under I have had the narrow date reverse. In fact I have only seen two 1875Cd's being sold since his 2009 book when type was first documented, both at auctions with LCA in 2016. Q. Does anyone know if the dot under first I of VICTORIA has actually (definitely) been seen paired with reverse L? Q. Isn't the dot under first I, type Cd, equally as rare as the cannon ball (and 1870 dot under Y) and worthy, therefore, of being in Richard's rarestpennies list?

Thanks Pete, I don't have access to the CGS website pictures, but did check the aboutfarthings website and it wasn't mentioned on there.

Not great with Farthings but picked up an 1822 the other day and spotted that the date seemed unusual. Someone will probably now tell me that this repair is well known!!

Wasn't it a cue for Bottom to grab a hand? I guess if it had been the other way round that may have also caused an issue with FB!

I've just listed a 1966 Freeman 2nd edition on ebay if anyone is interested. It's under books, not coins, so usual searches may not find it.

Sounds good to me Mike, but maybe tomorrow will be better. Stop the world.....