Red Riley

Many POWs had a desire to get out of their prison camp, so any legal currency would be retained for use on an escape. Having tokens circulating in the camp meant they had a currency which was useless outside. Think I'm right in saying that they weren't technically POWs but non-combatant Germans stranded in this country on the outbreak of war, many of whom were were vehemently opposed to the Nazi regime. In most cases the chances of them wanting to escape and head back to Germany was nil to negligable. In fact many of the internees campaigned to be allowed to fight for us! After the war many of them stayed on here.

OK, I'm going to come out with one of my totally unromantic theories again. 1) They ran out of 3 punches; 2) They detailed the apprentice to cut a new one; 3) After a few thousand pennies had been run off, they decided it was rubbish; 4) They got a proper engraver to cut a new one; 5) They gave the apprentice a clip round the ear. How does that sound?

If the first is genuine (I can't tell without a lot of Photoshopping), it's probably Diocletian or one of the many short-lived emperors of the mid-late 3rd century A.D. As far as value is concerned, even if it is genuine, probably not worth a fortune as this type of coin is turned up quite regularly by metal detectorists. The second is definitely a gaming token and I would tend to agree with John (argentumandcoins) re the third.

Don't know whether it's just me but the amount of garbage seems to have dropped off lately. Leastways, I seem to be finding it easier to navigate my way through recently. Fully agree with the sentiment though.

Noooooooo... You're a pussycat.

If you're selling on e-bay; 1) Never put 'no returns'. It's an e-bay default but it puts me right off. 2) Use a sensible rate of postal charges. 3) Insert the best photos you can. 4) Always come across as a reasonable guy. Don't include great long lists of people banned from bidding. I saw one misanthrop last week get buttons for a very good coin. Since he banned half the world from bidding in the most miserable and mean-spirited way possible, I felt it served him right. More when I think of it.

Dave, An update of 19th century coins would be a tall order, but to take a bit of it such as overdates would perhaps be more manageable. I used a large number of images in writing 'The Standard Guide...'. Feel free to use these, as well as any on my website - I also archive pictures of coins I have sold, so always ask if you can't find what you want. I am sure that others on here will help in the same way.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160559216667#description

If we're not careful we're going to end up on the subject of Madeline Smith again...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300541253844 Presumably a jeweller with a can of Duraglit...

Welcome to the forum Uncle Phil. What you collect may depend on your definition of 'around in your lifetime'. I'm not yet in possession of a bus pass but even I can remember Victorian bun pennies, halfpennies and even the odd silver item in circulation. I guess it all depends on your budget but a decent example of each back to the 19th century shouldn't really break the bank.

Yes I would agree. Michael Gouby has a better one (Fair/Fair+) at £90 and a truly awful one at £40, so Rob's estimate of £50 is probably not that wide of the mark. From the point of view of assessing value, E-bay BIY's are as much use as a chocolate tea pot. Always worth checking Michael's site as he has seems to have half the world's coins on it at any one time!

Yes I would agree.

Or perhaps some baby oil...

Hi Peteuk, welcome to the forum. Condition of the coins is very important, but as a start can you post images of the 1903 and 1918 penny reverses (tails side). As you have surmised, the vast bulk of these will be worthless but you never know...

I alway s come back to the days in the late 60s and early 70s working on the cash desk in my dad's shop. A few random thoughts; Silver from the whole of George V's reign was pretty common i.e. 1911 up, but it did get scarcer as time went on. The oldest silver I can recall was an 1872 florin (just legible) but that was the only Gothic I ever saw. Anything pre-1911 was pretty scarce. Pre-1947 silver was still around but getting fairly shabby by that time, say Fine max. Unpleasant to handle as worn coins tend to stick together. I never saw a 'Standing Britannia' florin in circulation so extrapolating that fact, I would say that the 1950s is way too late for the demise of the Gothic florin. I would guess that other than the odd straggler they dropped out of use around the time of the First World War; Banks withdraw underweight coins for the simple reason that, certainly at that time, change was weighed into bags and not counted. Worn coins therefore mess up their calculations. 92.5% silver wears very quickly, much more so than today's cupro-nickel issues and after 20 or so years we are perhaps talking Fine. It was not unusual to see at say 1970, the George V Modified Effigy series with the legend at least half worn away. I find the actual use of coins in circulation and how they wear to be a fairly absorbing topic. More thoughts as they occur to me.

Which translated means, 'I saw, green, I conquered' Back to school Dave...

Brute aderat forte Caesar adsum jam Brute sic in omnibus Caesar sic intram. Will that do? I was fortunate in that my old Dad taught me Roman numerals when I was about six (why, I have no idea) and I've remembered them ever since.

Coin images are frankly a nightmare. I've been known to photograph a coin a dozen times just to get it to look like it does in the hand and in certain cases I've failed and just put it in the back of a cupboard in despair. Silver is easier than bronze, copper and even gold where the lack of tone makes a coin look 'flat'. If a base metal coin has uneven or mottled toning, the camera confuses this with its design contours and even though the coin may be near to uncirculated, the result is simply a muddle. When a coin has the slightest speck of verdigris, virtually invisible to the naked eye, an image can make it stand out like a spotlight.

The medal/medallion on the queen's shoulder is the acid test here. You can also try the lions on the reverse, but quite frequently the dies blocked up and muffled the detail.

Last time I used them it got lost somewhere between Mombassa and Timbuktu...

On the other hand the coins may be several hundred years old by the time they are slabbed. Somehow or other their lustre/tone has survived to this point. If you treat them with care they shouldn't really change that much.

Totally agree. In cases like the rare 1905 halfcrown, where fakes exist, CGS comes into its own. Yes I agree, the only coins worth slabbing are those where the market has become overheated and there is a problem with Far Eastern forgeries. Northumberland Shillings spring to mind.

I think that makes it more likely that it is a modern forgery. Viking settlements were seldom on the site of modern towns (or if they were, the towns have expanded exponentially). More likely a kid got it on a school trip to the Yorvik Centre, got bored of it and lobbed it out the window.

And if you're not interested...