Rob

More must have iFaults Gotta get me one of these for the phone collection - ticks the dysfunctional product box

There is also the RM museum. They may still have the original dies to compare. It would take a while to hear back from them.

No, sorry.

No. All the early ones have gone. Just left with 1998 onwards, or maybe one 1995 issue if I can find it. Quite a few complete years and a lot of duplicates.

same as the 2011, just the daate is different

But you could afford it, just you have made a decision to collect diversity in quantity over a smaller selection of specific pieces. I haven't done the sums, but if you added up all the prices you have listed in the various acquisition threads it is clear you could afford it several times over. And if not that one, something similar.

I typically deslab 1-3 coins a year, most of which seem to cost considerably more than 499

Second edit required, Dave? Amny thnaks.

Yes, but even the oft maligned estate agents have some competitors offering a fixed fee service. Here we have a (not very cheap) service aimed at presumably the less confident collector. Put another way. Why do so many people buy LMO products? It's a case of marketing a product above its regular market value for a similar item. People think they are getting something that is a good investment and (often unwittingly) pay multiples of market value for that item. Slabbing is surely no different. Each and every one of us say the same thing - buy the coin and not the slab. It's easier to inspect an unslabbed coin, however, it's also easier to let someone give an opinion on grade while you sit back and accept this unquestioningly. TBH, people who blindly spend tens of thousands on things without due diligence are equally to blame for any value shortfall. Bet they wouldn't buy their car without seeing or sitting in it first. It boils down to greed in all probability just like any other get rich quick scheme.

The question remains though, who assigns the value? This is a conflict of interests because remuneration is tied to a value assigned by the recipient of your money. If slabbing has to be done, and I have no reason to deny them the right to offer a service, then it should be a flat fee service. The time taken to grade a £10 coin should be no more or less than that required to do a £10K coin - if the job is done properly. By all means charge higher shipping due to the insurance, but if you are paying more to have a high value coin graded it tells me that either someone is skimping somewhere or alternatively, someone is being ripped off for the time actually taken.

That should make it pretty excusive if extended to existing members - approximately 32 coins at lowest price, or just one coin valued at £25K. I presume the 2% fee is based on their own (inflated) valuation. It is certainly going to exclude the casual person slabbing. Given the find an agent link requires you to be logged in and to log in you have to be a member and to become a member you now have to pay £500, I see it all ending in tears. It isn't directed at any TPG in particular, but these membership fees are a huge premium to pay for something that is essentially a hobby. Why try to frighten people away? Or are they trying to emulate the less scrupulous vendors in asking OTT prices for something that isn't realisable. It's alright asking a premium, but people new to the hobby would expect that extra expenditure to help realise higher prices when the time comes to sell. Unless the TPGs offer a market which trades at higher prices to the real world, it's a case of fools and their money soon parted. I can see a parallel with other selling scandals.

Estimates are a difficult one. Typically an estimate should be set low as it will presumably reflect what the estimated market value is after a bit of competition. Given the current premium of 20% + VAT, an upper estimate of say 80% should in theory be somewhere about reference book prices, with lower estimate below that and a reflection of the reserve if applied. However, all this goes out the window when two people want the same thing.

Yes, I have never understood the rationale for paying someone unknown to give an opinion which is no more valid than my own......... I'll give my opinion for free.

£100 not wasted on membership will probably land me a fairly hard to find medieval episcopal penny. They aren't that expensive, primarily because they rarely turn up in a desirable grade.

As I see it, you can be relieved of £99 for the privilege of CGS membership, or the £s equivalent of £102 for PCGS membership, both of which profess to offer an opinion that I am incapable of making myself. Either way I'm about £100 lighter in the pocket. Vive la difference.

Only two to possibly interest me initially - the no legend reverse Moore and the unadopted 1797 designs pattern, but the latter is too spotty and the former has a spot of verd too on the reverse behind Britannia.

It's a pity Steve didn't list the provenances of every coin. Saves having to go back through the sales to find them and at least gives you a starting point to push them back further in time.

If the flan is even slightly smaller, some, all or none of a particular feature can be struck up. It's a complete lottery as to what is seen.

There would be no problem using the wrong date as the issues of cartwheels would testify. These were struck after 1797 but the date didn't change.

It's just the ongoing obsession with the British public about 50ps and how rare they must be. I get called once or twice a day asking how much I would pay for various 50ps. The reply of 50p is usually met with derision because people are asking a couple hundred quid on eBay for them. When you explain that eBay is the only place you are likely to find someone stupid enough to pay that, they don't believe you. There's a real fixation in the minds of the public that the commemorative 50ps are worth a fair amount, or at least considerably more than 50p. Makes you wonder why the RM release any onto the market given they are always worth more than face - not.

The problem being of course that unless someone does actually leave, the alternative is nothing will happen. Even a majority of one in the referendum for staying in will be portrayed as a resounding endorsement of the status quo and a vindication of the current setup.

I think it is also worth pointing out that the EU inspired legislation on the books will only be selectively removed should we leave and even then only gradually over time, because to remove it all at a stroke would leave a vacuum resulting in anarchy. We will keep the bits that suit us and ditch the rest, so the fear campaign's message of impending doom doesn't really hold water. People aren't going to be made slaves as a result of the EU not determining our legislation, nor are we suddenly going to become a heartless nation. The vast majority from all political persuasions have always and are always likely to have a social conscience. As for the last point made by Richard 'When it comes down to it I think it all boils down to how you feel about the power balance within Europe and whether you're more a nationalist (small n) or federalist I guess.' For the first time in over 40 years, people are being asked if they want to take a nationalist or federalist stance. If the EU decided to have a referendum, the question would only ever be do you want to be more federalist. And if the answer received wasn't 'Yes', the question would be asked again and again until it was obtained. If this country voted 'Out', the door would always be open to future governments to rejoin should it be in our interests, albeit most likely on stricter binding terms, because the desire for centralised power would over-ride the current rhetoric. It's their ball to take away or allow you to play with at their whim. The fundamental question remains. Do we wish to remain subservient to an unelected and unaccountable group of 28 autocrats and the polycracy that is the EU leadership? Sorry, but that really is a rhetorical question for me.

I still feel that the lack of factual reasons given by the In group hits the nail on the head. The main reason for staying in appears to be fear of the unknown (plus a few of the more vociferous supporters worry they will be thrown off the gravy train). If the outcome of this referendum is that we stay in Europe, it will be a damning endictment of the indifferent attitude people have to democracy. I also wonder what the attitude will be of the EU to this country going forward. I suspect a tightening of central control will happen to dissuade anyone else from having independent thought. Considering the Lib Dems have spent decades voicing their support for all things European, I'm surprised there haven't been any statements of support for the In campaign. As the most solidly pro-European political group in this country you would have expected them to say something. Irrespective of how far down in the polls they are, the party machine is still operative. Or maybe they are unwilling/unable to explain their unswerving subservience to a foreign institution over which they have no control.