absence of uniformity

Currently it's a split decision. An equal amount of people say they see a H and the same amount say no H. Respectively the opinion of the members here I value to be of higher credence however I will remain on the fence until I have completed my search for an identifiable die characteristic unique to Heaton coins. If nothing else it's a great learning experience for me and a good reason to learn to look closely at details, going forward I will need those skills. I have spent a good few hours and found some differences between F82 and F85 on some coins, each time I find a consistant different detail I then find a coin in between the two or find an example which proves the theory incorrect. Part of my issue when trying to corroborate apparent differences is the inconsistant grade and or photos of different coins I'm looking at. If I had 20 uncirculated F82s and 20 F85s with photos taken under the same conditions would probably be more decisive. It's a challenge out of interest rather than simply going against opinion. Up until now I have only been studying the reverse, I will check the obverse to see if I can find any consistant differences between Heaton and London die pairings for 8+J This coin was not purchased as F85 and it was purchased cheap, already the purchase has provided me with hours of interest and learning about grade and scrutinizing details.

Thanks, I dont have a clue what I'm talking about hence me posting here about it. One thought I had if the 5 is manually added or punched would that account for variation in the position of the 5. Please see the following image.

@PWA 1967 7 Vs 1 currently, I'm not sure myself, seems logical to favour the popular opinion😃 Thats why I love types like F90 Peter, clear as day.

Im going to study the 1875 and 1875 H there must be an identifiable die characteristic unique to the H coins. Lets see.

@PWA 1967 I appreciate the input, In the sellers photos I can see a H. Can you not? What is the opinion of others? Thanks

And here is the sellers image

I'm pleased to share with this 1875H coin I have just purchased. (I think the seller missed the H) In your opinion what is the grade please of this coin, my gut feeling is GVF/GVF I'm inexperienced and am a bit lost when it comes to grading. There is rim damage and a few stains, you can also just some some luster around some of the legends. I know the following is only a basic guide but its difficult for me to be sure how the coins grades. 1) VF-20 We start to see all major line in the hair. The thistle and shamrock decorations starts to appear. Clearly readable but lightly worn legends, illustrations show good detail, rims are clean, but the whole coin shows moderate wear on the high points. 2) EF-40 Hair lines are mostly sharp and distinct except above forehead. The rose, thistle and shamrock decorations are visible. Legends are sharp, illustrations are clear with slight but obvious wear on the high points. 3) AU-50 Hair above forehead are visible and dress details are distinct. Sharp legends and illustrations show only a trace of wear on the highest points. There must be some remaining mint luster." Note inside the bottom of the Letter O in One the small flat part which does not appear to be damage. I would be grateful to hear opinions please. Thanks.

Thank you Richard, this is what I would like to track down.

thanks !

Ok thanks ! I purchased a copy from Chris a while back.

Thanks again ! Il let you know if I win.

I believe we can see only the top portion of the 4 makng it appear widely spaced.

The burr where the drill has blown out the metal is bronze coloured. I believe we can see only the top portion of the 4 makng it appear widely spaced.

1874H Freeman 66 dies 6+G is my guess; just inside the hole it looks bronze coloured.

Would anyone have a copy for sale please? Are all the Penny varieties covered? Did Michael write a book which covers only Penny types and die pairings. How much info was added to the 5th edition? The British Bronze Coinage: Pence, Halfpence and Farthings 1860 - 1869 (5th Edition) by Michael Gouby Loose Leaf, 60 Pages, Published 2006 ISBN-10: 0-948855-11-8 / 0948855118 ISBN-13: 978-0-948855-11-5 / 9780948855115 many thanks !

Thank you very much ! That F148 is really nice, amazing find. I dont expect to find another F90, wont stop me looking though.... 1861 2+F maybe a tricky one to find although the 1863 F44 slender 3 Freemans own example was thought to unique for many years then three more examples turned up. It's a monumental challenge especially unattributed to try and find all the types. If there is one 2+F I have hope there is more. Same for the other types.

What the heck, Im just going to share it ! So pleased it's the reverse which is in better condition. I know on these rarities grade is kind of irrelevant but what is your opinion please? Thanks

I find a indentifier like this then simply search high and low and open as many examples on the computer in seperate windows once I have 20-30 coins open in the browser go through each one focussing on the identifier only and then close the windows as I check them.

You mention dealers listing the coin in error, in my spreadsheet I have this image which I made which may help you id the type in poor condition and or poor photos in the sellers listing

Thank you ! For 1897V+xBP1897C1+CF148 I can see a brown AU example sold for $1200 through LCA and in Fine grade around $120 and going back to 2004 I can see around 14 examples have been sold through London coins (LCA) If you can settle for an example around (F) Im sure if you persist you can find one or purchase one?. Its probably much less likely to find a high grade coin unattributed. But never say never, I would imagine higher grade coins attract more attention even for standard types meaning more people have checked over the coin.

I would like to try find one example of every known variety. In 3 months I have found two of the rarer coins in the list, I have accepted I may have to purchase a few attributed types but the more I find the more I'm obliged to continue with this challenge. Its unlikely but lets say I did compile a collection of all the known varieties for the bun head penny series. Do people auction complete collections? I plan to invest in books. Does anyone have any books for sale please which may be of use to me.

The overall grade of the coin is really not bad, looking at the other examples my coin is certainly not the lowest grade/condition of the known examples.

I am delighted to share with you my most recent discovery ! I still cant believe it. I search to the point I literally become so sick and tired and just as I'm about to have a break as I cant take no more....... I find something like this, then the motivation is completely replenished. £16 with postage.... I feel a bit bad if im honest, I wouldnt call the seller a dealer but looking at the inventory not sure how they missed this one. I have only included part image of the coin as I would like to let the dust settle, I dont want the UK seller to get wind of it. In time I will share the complete coin.