absence of uniformity

Excellent thank you for taking the time to explain this. Makes perfect sense.

I was under the impression this forum is for educational purposes. A genuine coin related question IMO is worthy of a relevant response. For you and any other's please just scroll past if you are not capable of keeping it informative/educational.

Are you bored again Rob?

I doubt it but will this add any premium to a otherwise normal coin? Thanks.

@secret santa On my coin I'm consistently counting over the 138 tooth count listed on the website for Freeman Reverse E. I read the following; THE 1860 BRONZE RECOINAGE OF PENNIES PAUL M. HOLLAND "The reverse D´ type has only been found paired with obverse 3, and is without the ‘rock line’, but having the sea strongly re-cut both near the shield and at Britannia’s foot. Roughly half of obverse 3 pennies have this reverse and the others reverse D*, except for a few with the rare ‘LCW below foot’ reverse E type. The 1860 LCW below foot type reverse E (Peck reverse D, Freeman E, Gouby e) has 143 border teeth and exhibits a strongly patterned sea very similar to that of reverse D´. It is only found paired with obverse 3 and appears to have been a failed experiment, with most examples exhibiting multiple reverse die cracks. Circulated reverse E coins also show that the lap of Britannia is quickly worn away, suggesting significant problems with die relief. A survey of more than twenty examples of ‘LCW below foot’ pennies shows that nearly all of them exhibit die cracks on the reverse, with at least four different reverse working dies known. The similarity of the strongly patterned sea between reverses D´ and E, coupled with the observation that reverse D´ has so far only been found paired with obverse 3, suggests a scenario where reverse D´ probably preceded the failed reverse E experiment, and then both reverses were abandoned" It must be a typo because the coin imaged as reverse E on the website site also has 143 tooth count. Ahd the Freeman book I have doesn't list the tooth count for Reverse E.

Interestingly nobody gave an opinion on this coin. Is no news good news?

In a way I suppose its kind of compliment but maybe also a tad rude to suggest I'm being dishonest with these discoveries. If you are not putting in the legwork it doesn't mean other's aren't. With all due respect I invite you to invest a bit more time in looking for what you want. And maybe you will have some luck.

There is no way I could cook up this story, its too elaborate, its hard work paying off in the form of luck.

And to show you how poor the original photos were here is the same coin imaged with a DLSR with a macro lense and natural light + flash.

Sellers images of the complete coin, note you can just see the LCW and my imaginery crossbar.

So I wont comment on the other thread now @jelida here is what lead me to beleive the coin was BP1860Jb (Gouby D+d; Freeman 2+D) – V over inverted A in VICTORIA from the sellers images. I received the coin and annoyingly the crossbar is not visible only a faint line from one low angle using a loupe, so its not BP1860Jb. To my surprise😂 LCW is visible under Britannias foot, I know you couldnt make it up. If I hadnt of mistaken the V over inverted A and didnt purchase the coin £5.40 I now wouldnt own a BP1860M3 LCW below Britannia’s foot.

Without @secret santa and his site I would not have found what I have simple as that. This single resource of information has proven to be highly useful its all I use if I'm honest. I have the Freeman book but I dont use it. Richard's site is far easier to use as its all in digital. I use it all day everyday! I owe you a pint Richard. I would happily make a donation given how much Im using it. @jelida If you are that interested you can see my real name on Richards site, im not hiding anything for me its an honour to have my name next to rarities such as the F90 on there. As I have said above I have worked bloody hard for that.

Understand the drive and motivation when a rare coin is discovered for nothing. It makes me search longer and more intensively after each find.

Hit the nail on the head.

Him 😊I really appreciate that thanks! As I say above you get out what you put in.

The reality is the coins are out there to be found, how intensively are you prepared to search for them? Ofcourse a little bit of luck and chance is involved. But I have worked bloody hard to find what I have.

I started this thread and while waiting for the coin to arrive I found the other thread on the subject and thought it was appropriate to comment. 🤣 delear? I'm a complete beginner collector and have not purchased a collection. I'm searching for varities 11hrs+/ day 7 days a week. Even if I sold what I have so far including the higher value coins I'm proably on much less than min wage for the time I have invested. When is the next coin fair Jerry you will attend and I will happily come and meet you and bring my coins aswell. Not sure how you can confuse me as a pro given all the mistakes I have made and questions, and its not as if Im selling any of the coins I'm finding... Hear this; the harder I work the luckier I become and hard work beats talent. I'm not having a quick glance at a few dealers websites Im searching the world Jerry 24/7 and sometimes more than 11hrs a day.

And yet another mistake its not a variety it is a die pairing.

It's really not obvious from those poor images but is clearly visible. I will wait before uploading my images to see if anyone can spot the type.

If I didn't mistake the V as having a crossbar I wouldnt of purchased the coin and in turn wouldnt have the variety I now do. Very lucky on this one.

Can you spot what the coin actually is?

Here are the listing images, Almost impossible to see from these images, but can you spot the variety? The coin is not actually missing the top left section of rim, the software when removing the background did this.

So I received the coin, I regret to say its not what I thought. Here is the sellers image; It really did look there is a crossbar in the V. When in hand there is nothing but a faint partial anomaly line when viewed from certain angles. All is not lost though because it turns out the coins is a different type......... Which is unquestionable and rare. Quite lucky really I am. See if you can spot the type when I upload my images, pretty clear however in the sellers images as you will see the actual type is hidden quite well. I mistaked the coin for the same die pairing as the 1860 Jb (V over inverted A) I have alot to learn. Given the V over inverted A is a "novelty" type maybe the one I have found is a better find. Images to follow.

The BP1860Jb you have listed on the website as you know sold for 3k. Which is a fair chunk of money, I get what you are saying. I was just using the F90 as example of early on when there is not many availible examples of a certain type they appear to do better at auction, thats the point I was making. Is there a collector out there ready to buy a BP1860Jb probably. Who knows what any given person may find interesting or how they value different types? I'm a complete beginner since three months hence all my questions and also mistakes. What is good for this type is Michael Gouby has acknowledged, confirmed and written about it. As I'm learning that in itself will increase interest for sure. Until now there was not another example availible which means no supply and in turn no demand. On its own maybe it's not so important but as part of a collection personaly I think it adds value.