declanwmagee Posted February 19, 2011 Posted February 19, 2011 I'm starting to have some fun with my new copy of Davies, and have managed to score a highish (nEF) 1+A 1887 Shilling at a 1+C price, as most sellers don't distinguish. Davies certainly did, suggesting £28 for top grade 1+A, and £7 for 1+C. Not that the values mean much now but it indicates that he reckoned it was about 4 times as difficult to find a good 1+A as the 1+C.I still have photos for the 9 1887 Shillings that have passed through my hands in the last couple of years, so I went through them and found they were all 1+C. To Davies, it's all about the shape of the tail of the Q in the garter, and Gouby's website concurs. Marvellous.Glancing though CCGB I came across a sidenote about the pointing of the device that separates the 18 and the 87 of the date, so went back through the 9 photos I have and found that they all point between beads. I'm getting quite a taste for pointings, thanks to Mr Groom, so much easier than "a bit bigger" or "a bit narrower" etc.Checking my new 1+A, the device is not between beads but ever so slightly to the right of a bead. So, does anyone know if the pointing of the device CCGB mentions is a direct function of the die letters used by Davies, or was it just chance that all the 1+Cs I've had happened to be "device points between beads". Sorry if that sounds a bit muddled; I had a tooth out yesterday so there's still a bit of brainfizz going on...cheersDeclan Quote
declanwmagee Posted February 20, 2011 Author Posted February 20, 2011 Pics to make my witterings clearer..."Normal" 1+C to the left, Scarcer 1+A to the right in both cases.Question is, does the loopy Q of 1+C always go with the centred device, or are there device variations for each Q variety, do you think? Quote
Badger Posted February 20, 2011 Posted February 20, 2011 Hi, as far I am aware it is a direct function, all rev A have the same device pointings, all rev B have the same pointings and also all the rev Cs are the same device pointings. I checked a good lot of 1887s a few years ago to see if the same reverses had different device pointings but found them all to be consistent with the A, B or C reverses.RegardsBadger Quote
declanwmagee Posted February 20, 2011 Author Posted February 20, 2011 Hi, as far I am aware it is a direct function, all rev A have the same device pointings, all rev B have the same pointings and also all the rev Cs are the same device pointings. I checked a good lot of 1887s a few years ago to see if the same reverses had different device pointings but found them all to be consistent with the A, B or C reverses.RegardsBadgerAh, brilliant - thanks Badger! It would niggle me if i thought that the 3 kinds of 1887 in my database wasn't quite the full picture, semiautistic coinie that I am... Quote
Badger Posted February 20, 2011 Posted February 20, 2011 The 1889s have a new pairing not listed in Davies if your interested? The 1889s I know of so far. . . D984 1+C with close spaced 89D984 1+C with wide spaced 89 (a big difference)D985 1+DD986 2+DD987 3+DD unlisted 2+C (I found one of these a couple of years back and Peter Davies has confirmed the variety and has came across a few since publishing his book)Regards Quote
declanwmagee Posted February 20, 2011 Author Posted February 20, 2011 The 1889s have a new pairing not listed in Davies if your interested? The 1889s I know of so far. . . D984 1+C with close spaced 89D984 1+C with wide spaced 89 (a big difference)D985 1+DD986 2+DD987 3+DD unlisted 2+C (I found one of these a couple of years back and Peter Davies has confirmed the variety and has came across a few since publishing his book)Regardsoh bloody hell!I suppose the nature of this is that completeness is impossible to achieve - not just collecting the coins, but even cataloguing the coins you could get!keep 'em coming! Quote
davidrj Posted February 20, 2011 Posted February 20, 2011 oh bloody hell!I suppose the nature of this is that completeness is impossible to achieve - not just collecting the coins, but even cataloguing the coins you could get!George V pennies seem to be going that way of late!!!!David Quote
Peckris Posted February 20, 2011 Posted February 20, 2011 oh bloody hell!I suppose the nature of this is that completeness is impossible to achieve - not just collecting the coins, but even cataloguing the coins you could get!George V pennies seem to be going that way of late!!!!DavidYes, I'd like to nominate 1914 and 1917 as the only two years there aren't varieties for (yet..), before 1927 Quote
Red Riley Posted February 21, 2011 Posted February 21, 2011 Yes, I'd like to nominate 1914 and 1917 as the only two years there aren't varieties for (yet..), before 1927 Oh come on! Haven't you heard of the '1914 missing toenail' or '1917 cauliflower ear'? Clearly you've not been paying attention. Quote
1887jubilee Posted February 21, 2011 Posted February 21, 2011 Hi, as far I am aware it is a direct function, all rev A have the same device pointings, all rev B have the same pointings and also all the rev Cs are the same device pointings. I checked a good lot of 1887s a few years ago to see if the same reverses had different device pointings but found them all to be consistent with the A, B or C reverses.RegardsBadgerYes I concur with Badger. I have just had a quick look at 17 in my collection and 3 rev A have a large miss formed pellet slightly left of the bead. Similarly 5 rev B have the large miss formed pellet slightly left of the bead but the rim beads are wider. The 10 rev C all have the small pellet between beads. The sample includes a proof rev. C and Proof rev A. ( yes I know it isn't in the book and may just be a specimen). I look forward to hearing if there are any other variations. Quote
Peckris Posted February 21, 2011 Posted February 21, 2011 Yes, I'd like to nominate 1914 and 1917 as the only two years there aren't varieties for (yet..), before 1927 Oh come on! Haven't you heard of the '1914 missing toenail' or '1917 cauliflower ear'? Clearly you've not been paying attention.Damn! How could I have forgotten those? I say, you don't have a duplicate 1914TN you could sell me? Quote
HistoryTreasures Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 Thanks for writing the post, I had no idea that such varieties existed. Quote
HistoryTreasures Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 (edited) I have 7 of these in my possession right now, but only one of them has the dot at the bottom pointing to a denticle (to left). All the other 6 have a 'loopy-Q' and the dot goes in between. Is this an accurate ratio? Edited February 22, 2011 by HistoryTreasures Quote
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