1919H Penny

[Gary]

I have a bag of 1919H pennies and I decided to have a good look at them. I have come up with this coin which curious. The legend is chamfered and not square and sharp as on a normal penny. Have a look at the pics, not very easy to capture but I think you will see the difference. The coin is quite worn and has a mottled surface, maybe due to exposure to water. I at first thought a forgery but the size and weight is bang on, 9.2 gramms.

Opinions?

[Gary]

[Gary]

[Gary]

[Rob]

Looks like corrosion to me. If you have contact with a corrosive substance, the reaction will take place on all contacting surfaces. Assuming equal rates of reaction there will be a reduction in height of the facing surfaces, but you will also get removal of metal from the sides of the legend which would narrow the character. If the micro structure of the metal is consistent, this should in theory result in a narrowing of the flat surface on top of the letter with the same angle on the side of the letter being maintained as the metal is removed until eventually you will end up with a sharp line on top of the lettering. Microscopic stress flaws may make this not happen in reality as it will be easier for the metal to be removed where metal displacement has taken place in striking as this action would disturb the crystalline structure of the flan creating small flaws and making it easier for the corrosive substance to penetrate the surface and do disproportionate damage at these points. This would mean a faster rate of attrition on the vertical sides of the design. The surfaces of both sides are pitted, which is indicative of corrosion. Consistency of metal mix would also result in pitting depending on the material affected.

That's my theory. Any support or contradiction anyone?

[VickySilver]

Looks like water degradation on the more worn coin. I think it would be VERY hard to draw any conclusions from this piece. I have not noticed any lettering variants of significance in the 19H's I have seen but have not looked at too many of the "basal state" pieces either. I tend to agree with Rob however.

[Peckris]

Looks like corrosion to me. If you have contact with a corrosive substance, the reaction will take place on all contacting surfaces. Assuming equal rates of reaction there will be a reduction in height of the facing surfaces, but you will also get removal of metal from the sides of the legend which would narrow the character. If the micro structure of the metal is consistent, this should in theory result in a narrowing of the flat surface on top of the letter with the same angle on the side of the letter being maintained as the metal is removed until eventually you will end up with a sharp line on top of the lettering. Microscopic stress flaws may make this not happen in reality as it will be easier for the metal to be removed where metal displacement has taken place in striking as this action would disturb the crystalline structure of the flan creating small flaws and making it easier for the corrosive substance to penetrate the surface and do disproportionate damage at these points. This would mean a faster rate of attrition on the vertical sides of the design. The surfaces of both sides are pitted, which is indicative of corrosion. Consistency of metal mix would also result in pitting depending on the material affected.

That's my theory. Any support or contradiction anyone?

Looks like water degradation on the more worn coin. I think it would be VERY hard to draw any conclusions from this piece. I have not noticed any lettering variants of significance in the 19H's I have seen but have not looked at too many of the "basal state" pieces either. I tend to agree with Rob however.

Interesting. My first thought - before reading these replies - was "that's been re-tooled". But when you look at the state of the portrait and reverse, you'd have to ask, "why bother?" I don't have enough chemistry to argue with Rob's' thesis which sounds highly reasonable. I do have one observation though - if you look at the diagonal of the N in OMN: it appears to have been 'worked' (tiny chisel marks). Could natural erosion / corrosion cause that?

[VickySilver]

I would say "yes". Corrosion is quite odd in water and there may have been enhanced local elctrolytic action due to alloy just there andor the interaction with deposition salts, conglomerates, whatever...

[Gary]

Thanks for the time and effort. I am inclined to agree with your conclusions, water damage.

Have since seen a similar coin on ebay dated 1863 which seems to have suffered in the same way. the seller is selling as a thin date!

1863 different

[VickySilver]

Hey, I think we need to find some 1863s and a bit of saline plus a bathtub and create thin dates at home to sell on ebay for the bargain sum of 5k or so!LOL. Actually, these slender and narrow date buns in basal state are about as interesting IMO.