New Victoria Copper Penny reverse ?

[secret santa]

I have an 1855 P.T. penny which I bought because it appears to have the date numeral 5s in different fonts with the right hand 5 slightly "fatter".

However, the reverse of this coin appears to have a slightly different design with Britannia's chain mail bodice having what I describe as an ornate central panel. It's a pity that the coin isn't a higher grade but nevertheless it does look different to me.

 Normal Plain Trident reverse

My coin's reverse

Sorry about the size difference - it must be to do with the resolution of the originals.

Edited October 14, 2022 by secret santa
correction to wording

[alfnail]

Any chance of a better picture of this 'central panel' please Richard?

 

[secret santa]

Probably not. I don't have a microscope and the coin is slabbed. I'll have a go but don't hold your breath.

[terrysoldpennies]

I've increased the number of pixels and increased the size as much as the picture will allow if it's of any help.

[Bronze & Copper Collector]

I checked my 1855 plain tridents and there is one coin that might possibly be a match. More than likely it is my imagination running amok.

This coin I had identified about 15 years ago or so and placed separately amongst my 1855s inasmuch as the colon is slightly closer than on others.

It does have a slightly "fatter" last 5.

Richard, maybe you can compare the colon spacing and see if there is a match there. If so, then that might be an identifier if indeed there is something ornate in the breast plate.

If it is just a closer colon spacing, then it is merely a die variety. If indeed, in addition to the colon spacing, there is also a more ornate design on the breastplate, then we have identified a new reverse die.

Obviously the ideal situation would be to find a high grade example and either confirm or refute this observation.

Again, despite the definite difference in the colon spacing we might be in total fantasy land regarding any design on the breastplate.

 

[Bronze & Copper Collector]

[Bronze & Copper Collector]

[Bronze & Copper Collector]

[Bronze & Copper Collector]

[Bronze & Copper Collector]

[Bronze & Copper Collector]

Regardless of any similarity,  could you post images of both sides of your coin?

[secret santa]

Here's the fatter 5:

[alfnail]

1 hour ago, Bronze & Copper Collector said:

Hi Gary, this is an Ornamental Trident 

[alfnail]

On 10/14/2022 at 7:23 PM, secret santa said:

I have an 1855 P.T. penny which I bought because it appears to have the date numeral 5s in different fonts with the right hand 5 slightly "fatter".

Any thoughts on this 1855PT re. 2nd 5 being slightly "fatter"?

[Bronze & Copper Collector]

5 hours ago, alfnail said:

Hi Gary, this is an Ornamental Trident 

DUH!!

Of course you are absolutely CORRECT.

That will teach me to do reseaech when I am half asleep. I do have it listed properly in my spreadsheet abd hopefully in my album too.

At least that relieves me of any hallucinations I was having regarding any similarities between the 2 coins.

Anyway, so long as the images are posted already, Iain, have you come across an 1855 closer colon (much as the 1853 Peck-1503) such as this?thus??

Regards and thanks again.

[secret santa]

5 hours ago, alfnail said:

Any thoughts on this 1855PT re. 2nd 5 being slightly "fatter"?

It looks normal to me. The "tail" on mine looks fatter.

 

[alfnail]

 I agree that the second 5 on my coin is normal; it perhaps looks a bit fatter because it is tilted anti-clockwise.

In the absence of a really good close-up picture, I think it's impossible to tell what's going on with that date on your coin.

It could, for example, just be some grime on the inner curve, or some 'post-strike' damage (like the attached picture) making that part of the numeral look fatter than it was when struck.

  

[alfnail]

On 10/17/2022 at 2:36 PM, Bronze & Copper Collector said:

Iain, have you come across an 1855 closer colon (much as the 1853 Peck-1503) such as this?thus??

Regards and thanks again.

Hi Gary,

I haven't particularly studied the many variations in colon dot positions; in my experience the dot locations always vary a little bit from one die to the next.

I have acquired a nice 1853 Peck 1503, because it is a documented type, and have also noticed that 1851's (all OT's of course) have DEF colons at close, interim and far positions.

Below are examples of the close and interim on Gouby Style 2A (second 1 over 1), and Gouby Style 3 respectively.