youliveyoulean

daily rant over...have a nice day all and enjoy the weather!!

It's disgusting quite frankly. The Royal Mint is targeting new collectors out there off the back of the success of the 1st peter rabbit coin to make a quick buck with complete disregard for their reputation and the future of numismatics. It smacks of desperation re-releasing effectively the same coin NOT ONCE BUT TWICE!!! Their short term outlook is astonishing. When these coins are worth a tenner each in a few (or several) years time which is inevitable, they've lost a whole generation of potential collectors through ill feeling towards them through the losses suffered. They are worse than any cowboy dealers out there and should be ashamed.

Sorry just realised the item has been withdrawn? In that case probably an honest mistake. I would hope you could get away with bidding as many times as you like as long as it is in fact a replica and you have reasonable information to demonstrate as such - or else ebay is assisting criminal activity so they would have to back you up. Seller would probably block you first time round though if they are indeed a crook.

Perhaps the solution is to make the winning bid and then not pay stating it is in fact a replica. Nothing the seller can do.

Apologies if I ruffled a few feathers. No harm intended. I am genuinely interested to know what posters think is acceptable behaviour when it comes to the mark up on coins and generous description of grade by dealers (such as UNC when it is clearly not close). How is it so different to a mis-attribution of the variety?

I occasionally contradict myself all of the time but I can assure you it's deliberate.

I agree the price is high and not particularly fair. Buyers want the finest known or thereabouts and pay a huge premium for it. For some reason, some of these slabbed have sold for more than an individual FDC set so his price may be justified. I am not tryng to defend the dealer in any way, just provide another angle Selling £2 coins for upwards of £10 to new collectors is much worse in my opinion. In the financial world, someone looking into buying a VIP proof would be deemed a sophisticated investor who should know what they're doing.

It may make you angry that you think he was trying to charge 2K+ for a £100 coin but he just did what all sellers and auctions houses do. if he did a little research and was unsure as to the attribution, does he a) sell it as an ordinary proof and lose out big time or b ) initially advertise as a VIP proof to see if anyone agrees even though he suspects it may be an ordinary proof.......... How many times do you see an auctioneer do something similar with rare previously unknown varieties etc. Do they advertise it at £5 or give it a guide of £10,000 - £15,000 in the hope that someone agrees? Would you still use that auction house?

Perhaps he was too busy and forgot to amend the description as well as the price? Either way, based on that pricing you cannot say he is trying to sell it as a VIP proof!

He has this coin priced based on it not being a VIP variety but an ordinary proof (although some may think the price a little high!). Seems like he already acknowledges it is not a VIP proof (even if he thought so originally) so why would you get it regraded? Without knowing the buyer, I would be prepared to give this gentleman the benefit of the doubt. Refund of funds through ebay paypal etc. can take up to several days for returns and buyers can get angry if they don't get their refund immediately. He possibly panicked thinking he'd been ripped off and the return process didn't happen fast enough for his liking. People tend to get a bit edgy when they think they may have been swindled out of £2,850 Opens up an interesting debate about what is ethical and what is not when selling coins. Nearly every dealer, TPG and auction house I have encountered has described coins as UNC when they are clearly not........are they all unethical?

Understand what you are saying about pricing at £475 Sword however his pricing may be well thought out based on the changing circumstances. If there is doubt about its VIP status it should sell at a reduced price. As an example, LCA sold a 1953 proof halfcrown for £350 at their last auction, where presumably the buyer thought it was VIP with some of the other bidders not so sure. Surely this coin would have fetched far more had everyone believed it to be a VIP. I should point out I have no affiliation with this dealer by the way- just trying to play Devil's advocate!

Not having seen the coin, it may be worth pointing out that the dealer in question may disagree with the attribution on the slab. As long as he believes it to be a VIP proof then he is not trying to rip anyone off (although he should probably state something to the effect that he disagrees with the slab). Then the buyer can make a decision based on the reputation of the dealer. The R5 is merely a marker put down by ESC and we all know these have been proven to be a best guess at the time of writing. If PCGS believe there to be 23+ examples of that particular VIP proof, and it is stated as R5 by ESC, one or the other is incorrect, and it could possibly be PCGS who are incorrect. Again, the dealer in question may still be believe it to be R5 in which case he should explain himself!

3 for and one against for now. Assuming this is obverse 2, does this mean it is not a VIP Proof? Any chance the handful of VIP proof sets issued could have been produced from different dies?

Hi all, the attached coin was sold as a VIP Proof halfcrown back in September 2015 with LCA lot 414 (part of a 10 coin set). It was described as dies 1A (Davies 2310), however all I can see is obverse 2 as per the normal proofs. Can someone help clear up my understanding (or lack of!) on the differences associated with these 2 obverse dies? I have the 1982 1st Edition of BSC by Davies which may have been updated. Thanks for your time.

I'm sorry if this sounds a little blunt Jester, but it appears as though you are about to go down the slabbing route with little or no experience about how to go about it. Getting your own coins slabbed as someone who is new to this is most certainly NOT a mechanism you should be using to learn about grading coins in the first instance. It would also be wise to forget about making money from slabbing for now.

Jester, my only advice would be to think very carefully about slabbing a bunch of sixpences that can be bought for the price of the slabbing process itself. Ask yourself what is your reason for slabbing the coins. Is it to test your understanding of the grading system, a kind of personal challenge, for investment purposes or because you just prefer to view your coins in slab form with the added peace of mind you can fondle them without the risk of damage? I'll help you out with one of those. In my humble opinion these relatively modern sixpences are quite common in high grades and have no future as an investment....now with that grenade where's my tin hat...i'm just off to hide behind the sofa ;-)

ah ok for some reason it prefers internet explorer to google chrome.

thanks - must be doing something silly in my old age!

Hi all, does anyone know if there are issues with the NGC website? I've been trying without success to get onto the World Census (population report) for several days now. Thanks in advance,

Hi all, I am trying to locate the above catalogue for a description of a coin I recently purchased. Would anyone be able to help? Thanks for your time.

Just an update on this, you'll all be relieved to know this sold on ebay for almost exactly the same as 20 loose eagles that finished round about the same time. Very VERY silly!! At a guess, this poor chap will never use a TPG service again and will probably tell others. These TPGs risk devaluing their product at their peril.

perhaps you could weigh a handful of old halfcrowns yourself gathered from various sources and you will get your answer - they won't all be forgeries I can assure you.

I would suggest a bit of both Jaggy. If the most reputable TPGs want to associate themselves with such a practise, it's the beginning of the end for them. If you devalue the grading service to such an extent (they haven't even bothered to use the sheldon scale) then their opinion on grading becomes increasingly meaningless (which is what it is for a mint state coin on 1st day of release). They are effectively admitting these coins are not worth grading and it will eventually show through. I recall a conversation I had with Bill Pugsley a year or two ago. He was explaining to me how much time and resources went into grading a modern coin by CGS. I asked him what was the point to it all with a mint condition coin. To make CGS run as a business, I suggested to him they should just check authenticity, take the money and run and randomly assign a mint state designation as in a few years time the coin will have changed anyway with toning, milk spots etc. Being the honourable gentleman that he is, he gave me a funny look as if to say they shouldn't do that. I'm starting to see he was right. TPGs will fail in the end unless they stick to a decent set of principles.

It seems some collectors buying bullion now need reassurance their coins are in good condition on the 1st day of issue....

If you are that cautious about storing your coins, then perhaps something of proven archival quality is for you - look up saflips or something similar. you can heat seal these yourself. this won't eliminate the risk of scratches and dinks entirely. As for the eggs, well anything tastes good with bacon