How can i tell?

[Master Jmd]

i have an 18?? penny, and my problem is the '??' bit...the coin is very dark, and quite worn...is there any way to find out what the '??' bit is without damaging the coin?

it is definatly after 1860, and before 1895!

Edited April 7, 2004 by Master J.M.D

[Chris Perkins]

So it's a very worn bun penny. You may be able to make out what bust it is and narrow it down further, but assuming of course the the obv is just as worn then you'll probably find it impossible.

[Master Jmd]

i suppose i will never know then

[Chris Perkins]

Probably not, those kinds of kinds I usually just put out for scrap.

[custard1966]

If there's no Heaton mint mark (H) below the date we can safely eliminate 1882

If it has a beaded border (as opposed to toothed) that would mean 1860

If 'L. C. Wyon' is visible on the obverse (just under or just on the bottom of the bust) and/or on the reverse (under the shield or foot) that would help.

Other things like the shape of the lighthouse or the configuration & position of the rocks around it can be diagnostic.

There are other identifiable features too.

If you can post some pics, I'll have a bash - but no promises

[Master Jmd]

i have a digital camera, but even if i get a brillian picture, i think it is far to worn to tell...i will try to get a picture tomorow...

[TomGoodheart]

OK - this may or may not work. I have found sometimes that slightlywetting a coin (just use tapwater, though on a coin that worn it probably doesn't matter) allows you to read the details a bit better.

[william]

Really? I must try that sometime!

[Master Jmd]

here is a link to it:My 18??

Edited April 8, 2004 by Master J.M.D

[Chris Perkins]

That didn't work. You can't link to your password protected webmail account!

It'll only work for you, when you're logged in.

[Master Jmd]

how can i get it to here then?

[Chris Perkins]

With the 'File attachment' option at the bottom of the posting window when you post something.

You have to browse for the picture on your local hard drive.

[Master Jmd]

ok thanks :

My_Documents

[Chris Perkins]

No, you have to choose the actual jpg file.

[Master Jmd]

does this work?

[Emperor Oli]

No, as chris says, put it out for scrap

[custard1966]

The bit of rock just to the right of the lighthouse suggests its 1875 or later

so we've narrowed it down to 1875-1894

If you could post the obverse we might do a bit more

[Master Jmd]

i will be able to post the oberse this arfternoon (GMT)...and thanks

[Master Jmd]

obverse:

[custard1966]

Well that's a challenge

The nose looks pretty straight and the head is pretty adjacent to the B of BRITT (I think) so I think we can narrow it down further to being between 1881 and 1894. They didn't change the reverse very much between these dates.

Impossible to be more precise with it in that condition.

[Master Jmd]

ok then, thanks for your help...

...how do you know all this stuff anyway?

[custard1966]

If, like me, you collect bronze pennies, you MUST own the British Bronze Penny by Michael Gouby it has detailed pictures of every reverse and obverse and clues to help you detect the often subtle diferences

It's the best tool for coin identification I've seen

[Chris Perkins]

I don't have that book, but it sounds much easier to follow that the attempt to classify the varieties in the 2004 Spink!

[custard1966]

Yes, Spink have made an interesting attempt - and it's a pretty good one for a general catalogue. But there are so many varieties that they can't possibly cover them all.

The Gouby book has an interesting format, it's split into three horizontal sections, covering reverses, obverses and a bottom section listing combinations, rarity estimates and some very out of date values.

The three section approach means you can select obverse & reverse views independently to get the complete view of any given coin.

There's an even more specialised work by John Jerrams which covers just the years 1860-65 and lists over 60 varieties of currency penny (!)

Peck and Freeman and the most well-known reference works, but Gouby & Jerrams are more up to date and more useful (& have cross-references to Peck/Freeman).

[Master Jmd]

where can this book be purchased?...sounds interesting