Henry viii penny?

[chrislamb]

Attached are images of a penny I found this week, I think it is a Henry VIII penny, but would like your opinion.

[Geordie582]

Yep! I'd say Second coinage (1526-44) of Bishop Tunstall (Durham) Spinks S2354 or North 1813. A commoner type. Nice condition though!

[chrislamb]

In Spink it says the star mint mark is 1514-26, but also the CD beside the shield makes it the one you said but the dat it gives is 1530-, how can the mint mark date be different from the date given to shields with CD either side?

[Geordie582]

I see what you mean! But it seems to be over large, if you check the picture in Spinks, you'll see what I mean. Perhaps a late addition or to obliterate another mark? Many of these marks were used by the minter for their own purposes. What do other members think?

Edited November 30, 2006 by Geordie582

[Geordie582]

Where are all the Hammered collectors? No-one have any thoughts on this coin - I'm just interested

[chrislamb]

Where are all the Hammered collectors? No-one have any thoughts on this coin - I'm just interested

Me too!!

[scottishmoney]

These are commonly referred to as Sovereign pennies, because the portrait was similar to the one used on the Sovereign as opposed to the usual front facing image of the monarch.

[Geordie582]

The Star mint mark still bothers me! It is just too large. It would seem to have been added later, though for the life of me, I can't think of a valid reason they would deface the original mark and you would expect a late addition to be incused.

Edited December 5, 2006 by Geordie582

[Sylvester]

No idea Geordie why they'd do that!

As for where are the hammered collectors? I'm afriad the Tudors are way after my period of focus so i don't know much about them beyond the basics.

[Geordie582]

Do you agree with me that the 'star' is just too large? It even breaks the inner circle!

Could it be, following the 'Sede Vacante' period of 1529-30, they just used the unmarked pennies (S2353) and added the initials and the mint mark later? (though how they'd manage to do that escapes me)

Edited December 6, 2006 by Geordie582

[Sylvester]

I've gone and pulled out the Coincraft on this.

The size of the mintmark doesn't look too far of in my opinion (i think the fact that it's worn gives it the impression it's bigger). It is however definately moving over the inner circle which appears to be unusual.

Initials are on the reverse so it could be a mule. It could of course be an unrecognised variety.

The obverse dies might have had the star punched in later (before the coin was struck) with a worn punch, if done by hand it only takes a slight slip to go over the line.

[Geordie582]

Good analysis, Sylvester. I agree. I suppose a lot of re-use of dies must have been usual in those days. I don't suppose they were that easy to make, hence the elevated position of 'Mint Master'. An interesting coin for any collection!

By the way, It is not my area either. A bit late for me, really.

Edited December 7, 2006 by Geordie582

[chrislamb]

Thanks for all that, I will be giving it to my local Finds Liason Officer who will do a report on it. I will report back here once I get it back.

Cheers

Chris

[Guest Guest]

any idea of value?

[Geordie582]

I'd say you could pick one up for £5-10 on ebay! I've got one of Henry VII, about the same value, for £3 +p&p ( but it broke in the post!)

Edited December 13, 2006 by Geordie582

[Peter]

A nicely nibbled coin.

I wonder where the line was drawn when a coin would be accepted or not.

Apparrently in the 18C the Scots loved the copper evasions.

[Geordie582]

iI've asked that question before. The practice of cutting pieces out to prove the quality of the silver was quite common, so, unless everyone carried weigh scales, they were always being "short changed".

[Guest Guest]

I like mine best!!

[Geordie582]

I agree! But mine is 20 years older than yours

[chrislamb]

the key mint mark is 1530-44, star is 1514-26 Bishop tunstall was bishop of Durham 1530 mark CD was anytime after 1530.

[Geordie582]

Key mm is Henry VII (Spinks 2235). That puts it in his reign 1485-1509 (York Mint Archb. Rotherham) :rolleyes

Keys were placed on Henry VIII coins, but on profile portrate types andBelow Halfpennies.

Edited December 19, 2006 by Geordie582