Retrograde Edward I penny

[Badger 123]

Hello all.

Found this yesterday in the Darlington area.

Looking for as much information as possible. Is it a 700+ year old forgery or could it have been struck in error?

I've reversed the image with a 5p for reference, and included the original image also.

 

Thanks, Dave

[Ukstu]

Looks like a continental sterling. Possibly John of Brabant or John the blind. It definitely reads Ioan .Try looking on here 

https://www.sterlingimitations.com

 

Edited September 10, 2018 by Ukstu

[Badger 123]

2 hours ago, Ukstu said:

Looks like a continental sterling. Possibly John of Brabant or John the blind. It definitely reads Ioan .Try looking on here 

https://www.sterlingimitations.com

 

Thanks Stu. Yeah could definitely be one of those. Is it common for imitations to be a mirror image like that?

[Ukstu]

Just realised what you meant. So me seeing Ioan which i presumed is John is actually the reverse image. 

Some of the imitation coins where complete gobble de gook. People back then were pretty much illiterate so as long as the coin looked similar it was accepted as being 1d or legal tender so to speak , even the die cutters were illiterate. 

I suspect somewhere on that website there will be a similiar coin.  It is at present a continental imitation unless someone else can provide anymore insight into it with an exact ID. You could take it to your local FLO i suppose, they may have the answer. It's not an area i am fully familiar with unfortunately. It could also be an error coin but the portrait does not look quite right. Got me puzzled lol.

Anyone else got any ideas? Is it a mistrike of some sort?

 

Edited September 10, 2018 by Ukstu

[davetmoneyer]

Hi deffinately an imitation of a Lincoln Edward I. Very blundered obverse legend 

+ O (E?) ANGL DNS HYB rendered retrograde and CIVI TAS LIN COL also rendered retrograde 

Doubt this is Continental as the workmanship is so crude would say highly likely local forgery  produced around 1280-1300

[Coinery]

What does ‘retrograde’ mean in the context of coins like this? Not an area I have ever looked at, or fully appreciate.

[Coinery]

Just now, Coinery said:

What does ‘retrograde’ mean in the context of coins like this? Not an area I have ever looked at, or fully appreciate.

OK, got it, written backwards...duh!

[Coinery]

Another query, though...wouldn’t you expect to find a base, or debased, metal flan in a contemporary counterfeit? The metal in this one has blackened like buried silver and is showing no signs of corrosion?

Edited September 11, 2018 by Coinery

[Badger 123]

3 hours ago, davetmoneyer said:

Hi deffinately an imitation of a Lincoln Edward I. Very blundered obverse legend 

+ O (E?) ANGL DNS HYB rendered retrograde and CIVI TAS LIN COL also rendered retrograde 

Doubt this is Continental as the workmanship is so crude would say highly likely local forgery  produced around 1280-1300

I'm going along with this.

 

Just checking back through all reversed images I have of the coin and I can now see this inscription ^^^

 

Previously thought it was Durham mint, but it definitely says LIN COL.

Thank you so much for your time, and also @UKSTU. Its great to get a definitive ID as it all seems to stack up now.

Unless someone knows otherwise.....

 

Cheers

 

Dave

[Ukstu]

2 hours ago, Coinery said:

What does ‘retrograde’ mean in the context of coins like this? Not an area I have ever looked at, or fully appreciate.

That got me as well Stu lol even though i knew what it meant from Rhuddlan coins. Doh!

Glad you've got a solution Badger. Do look on that link i posted as it also covers contemporary imitations. It might also be worth contacting the owner of the site with images of it. He may be able to offer a bit more information on it. 

Best wishes

Stu.

[Badger 123]

21 minutes ago, Ukstu said:

That got me as well Stu lol even though i knew what it meant from Rhuddlan coins. Doh!

Glad you've got a solution Badger. Do look on that link i posted as it also covers contemporary imitations. It might also be worth contacting the owner of the site with images of it. He may be able to offer a bit more information on it. 

Best wishes

Stu.

Thanks again Stu. Yeah that link has some very good information and I'll be using it for first port of call reference in the future. I've messaged the site owner with a couple of images and asked his/her opinion.

Regards Dave

[Badger 123]

I got a reply from the message I sent. Looks like it is a local forgery.

Thanks everyone for their help.

Dave