5 shilling Dollar 1804 - forgery/copy question

[silverdog]

I must confess to knowing absolutely nothing about forgeries/copies etc..

Couldn't resisit picking this up the other day though - quite cheap

But as these were silver why would anyone make them in brass, or whatever it is ?

Anyone any idea ?

[Rob]

I must confess to knowing absolutely nothing about forgeries/copies etc..

Couldn't resisit picking this up the other day though - quite cheap

But as these were silver why would anyone make them in brass, or whatever it is ?

Anyone any idea ?

Because the cost of silver dipped brass is considerably cheaper than pure silver. Originally the coin would have had a silver wash applied to make it pass as a genuine 5/- piece. The silver price at this time fluctuated considerable. The initial used of countermarked 8 reales pieces wer made current for 4/9 in 1797, but by 1800 the silver price was 5/6 for the same thing. The 1804 5/- dollar was current for what it said, but by the end of the decade was up at around 5/6 again. Brass is not really obviously less dense than silver when weighed in the hand, so there would have been a good chance of the counterfeiter succeeding in getting them into the market place unless the recipient was able to compare with a genuine piece.

[silverdog]

Rob

thanks for your reply and information

wouldn't tiny amounts of the silver wash remain though ?

I can see absolutely no traces of any ?

[Rob]

Rob

thanks for your reply and information

wouldn't tiny amounts of the silver wash remain though ?

I can see absolutely no traces of any ?

Not necessarily.

[Peckris]

Rob

thanks for your reply and information

wouldn't tiny amounts of the silver wash remain though ?

I can see absolutely no traces of any ?

I have a copper 1816 shilling with no silvering left on it at all. Maybe someone made a practice of rounding up forgeries and recovering the silver by chemical means.

As to the 1804, one other tantalising possibility is that it was a silver-washed SPANISH forgery that slipped through and got overstamped as a dollar before losing its silver. Which would make it a genuine Boulton strike on top of a forgery ...