John short cross penny

[Richard2]

This coin was folded completely over like the Edward penny in my previous post. Rather foolishly forgot to take a photo of it in that condition and started the process of unfolding it.the first picture is about halfway through the job

At this point I could see it looked to be in very good condition . It was pretty easy to continue annealing and quenching the coin till it was flat. The annealing process did discolour the coin quite a lot so I had to re- tone it. And the result I think is amazing . Moneyer RICARD ON LV class 5a2 I believe

 

[mrbadexample]

Nice job.

[Ukstu]

Nicely done! Definitely 5a2 no doubt, reversed S is unmistakable. Quite a hard class to find in a good grade so you've done well. 

[Coinery]

Brilliant! 

[Guest Guest 216]

Would you please describe in more detail the process you used to straighten the coin out?

Thanks.

 

[Guest Guest 216]

Would you please describe in more detail the process you used to straighten the coin out? Thanks.

[Richard2]

On 8/10/2018 at 5:57 PM, Guest Guest 216 said:

Would you please describe in more detail the process you used to straighten the coin out? Thanks.

Well I’m still learning myself, maybe I got lucky with the two I’ve put up here but it can be a bit hit and miss I’m afraid. The method I’m using at the moment is a heat source, I’m using the wife’s creme brûlée torch, a pair of tweezers and a bowl of water. Firstly though try and get the bent coin clean of mud using distilled water and cotton buds, if you can run a soft wet cloth between the joint if folded right over. Dry it. Darken the room, this makes it easier to see when the coin reaches cherry red when you heat it. Next I set the flame on the torch, I’m still playing around with that setting at the moment. I’ve read if you have it too fierce it’s not good and that you need a slight green flame to heat the coin. So then using the tweezers pick the coin up and play the flame over the coin from about 3 inches away. Keep the flame moving and don’t heat at one area. When you see the whole coin turning dull red, drop it into the cold water straight away. Now comes the part where it can go horribly wrong, so don’t blame me. I suggest you have a go on some grotty looking hammereds to start with. Then using an assortment of different diameter round wooden sticks like chop sticks or kebab skewers, starting with the smallest first, I use a small wooden tapered wedge, slowly push the stick between the two sides of the coin. The coin should start to part quite easily, if it doesn’t you haven’t annealed it properly and so will have to go back and reheat it again. Basically you keep doing this , slowly opening the coin a little at a time using slightly bigger diameter sticks, each time heating and quenching till the coin is nearly flat . The last bit I put the coin between two bits of soft wood or lead and squeeze together in a vice. And with a bit of luck the coin stays in one piece. 

Here endeth the lesson

Good luck

[craigy]

well straightened, i leave mine as i found them now after a couple of mistakes lol

[Richard2]

As I said Craigy  it’can be hit and  miss , I got lucky with those two I think

[Coinery]

4 hours ago, Richard2 said:

As I said Craigy  it’can be hit and  miss , I got lucky with those two I think

Richard, do you reheat them and let them cool naturally after you’ve finished?

[Richard2]

7 hours ago, Coinery said:

Richard, do you reheat them and let them cool naturally after you’ve finished?

Yes ,thanks for reminding me. I should have mentioned that.Heating to cherry red again and allowing to cool naturally leaves the coin in the same metallurgical state it was before you started annealing it. The other thing of course is the coin can/will discolour during the process of annealing. So after you have flattened it to your liking it’s then time to retone to a desirable state. At the moment I’m none too sure of why it discolours , probably due to impurities in the metal or on the surface, mud etc. At the moment, the method I used on the two coins shown in this thread is very simply to put the coin in a small amount of household bleach, just enough to cover it and wait till the coin darkens to a desired colour, usually a minute or two. Wash thoroughly in water and pat dry. Have a look at the coin and decide if your happy with it . Next I wet the coin again and put between two small pieces of flattened tin foil.( shiny side on coin). Hold between finger and thumb for a bit, you should smell rotten eggs(sulphur). Then gently rub the coin, in between the foil still ,in a circular motion. Check the coin to see if the desired effect has been reached and stop. I then put coin in distilled water and using a cotton bud , gently go over the coin to further clean it. Then dry.

Now I know a lot of you may be cringing at my method of straightening and re-toning coins this way and I don’t blame you. The bleach and tin foil method is very basic, and I’ve read it can be/ is very damaging to the coin. There are other methods out there ,and I’m willing to learn. So if you know of another method let me know.

PLEASE DONT DO THIS ON COINS THAT MAY BE RARE OR VALUABLE TO YOU.

please read the disclaimer in the terms and conditions 😉

Here endeth the second lesson.

Richard

[Coinery]

Great tips, Richard. For what you started out with, and what you’ve ended up with, it has my vote! Top job! 👍

[Richard2]

Thanks Stuart, 

I went up to DNW on Friday to drop a coin off to them, and showed Chris Finch the John coin, told him what I had done to it and he was well impressed, lots of eye appeal ,which is selling well at the moment.

Its gone from a bent coin worth a few quid to something well over a hundred he reckons. Result.

[Guest Guest 216]

Richard2:
Thanks for describing your method for straightening the coin.

I like your statement "PLEASE DONT DO THIS ON COINS THAT MAY BE RARE OR VALUABLE TO YOU. " I have a penny of Offa on a wavy flan and have wonder many times if there is a way to flatten it out a bit. Several dealers have told me how to do it (basically put between 2 pieces of soft wood and use a vise). However it is not their coin, and I cringe at the thought that it could be ruined.

 

[Richard2]

15 minutes ago, Guest Guest 216 said:

Richard2:
Thanks for describing your method for straightening the coin.

I like your statement "PLEASE DONT DO THIS ON COINS THAT MAY BE RARE OR VALUABLE TO YOU. " I have a penny of Offa on a wavy flan and have wonder many times if there is a way to flatten it out a bit. Several dealers have told me how to do it (basically put between 2 pieces of soft wood and use a vise). However it is not their coin, and I cringe at the thought that it could be ruined.

 

No way would I attempt to straighten an Offa penny if I ever lucky enough to find one. These early broad flan Saxon coins are renowned to be very brittle . And just heating it is liable to crack it or shatter it. I have two Cnut penny’s that are bent but have so far resisted the urge to try and straighten them.

It would be good to see a picture of your Offa

[Ukstu]

I managed to get a crease out of a Henry II long cross coin once. I heated it up and put it between two pieces of wood and belted it with a rubber marquee tent mallet. Sorted it out nicely but i wouldn't recomend doing it on something expensive like a saxon or viking coin. 

Edited August 15, 2018 by Ukstu

[Guest Guest 216]

Quote: "It would be good to see a picture of your Offa"

For my Offa penny, see here:

http://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-95356

[Richard2]

1 hour ago, Guest Guest 216 said:

Quote: "It would be good to see a picture of your Offa"

For my Offa penny, see here:

http://www.forumancientcoins.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-95356

Very nice and rare coin, doesn’t look to have much wavy ness but personally I wouldn’t attempt to flatten it

[Guest Guest 216]

Quote: "Very nice and rare coin, doesn’t look to have much wavy ness but personally I wouldn’t attempt to flatten it "

 

The flan is more crumpled than the photo suggests. However, I've had it for nearly 30 years and do not intend to try flattening it.

I am really impressed with the work you did with the John penny that is the subject of this post.

[Richard2]

6 hours ago, Guest Guest 216 said:

I am really impressed with the work you did with the John penny that is the subject of this post

Thanks