Rob

The rims have contact marks and the design show signs of circulation particularly the obverse, so therefore this could not be graded as UNC even if from worn dies. Personally I would grade this as approaching EF but not quite there with the reverse a bit better so could justify an EF. The problem with worn dies is when to assign lower than normal relief in the design to wear due to circulation or not. If you have worn dies, they are old by definition which may have flaws. A razor sharp flaw over the top of a bun or the ear for example has clearly had no circulation and so could legitimately be called UNC. In the absence of an unambiguous feature, you must assume the flat spots are due to wear and grade accordingly. The dies may have blockage of the recessed parts of the die as well as wear to the high points. Don't forget that low relief to the normal high points equates to blocked dies and worn dies would show signs such as earplugs or a not very incuse WW for example. Another good example of this is the lions' faces on shield reverses. These are frequently filled in/worn on the face detail and a much better indicator of wear is the degree of flattening on the harp breast. These are conical, rarely show signs of infilling and wear flat in line with the amount of circulation

Presumably it is one of these. A two shillings/florin/10 pence piece. Initially introduced as a currency coin in 1849 with the Gothic Florin as part of the attempts at decimalisation in the 1840s. These were replaced starting in 1992 by the smaller 10 pence coin, the larger pieces were finally withdrawn in 1993.

You are comparing chalk with cheese because the 2 1876H coins pictured earlier are halfpennies, not pennies. The wide date (rev. K*) applies to Freeman 325 and 328, the narrow date (rev. M) to Freeman 326, 327, 329 & 329A. Yours is Freeman 89 with rev. K which is the narrow date for the penny.

One Edward 1st 1/2d which I think is type 3g, but legend has no L in ANGL which conflicts with both Spink and North. Somebody put me right please. Diameter 15mm, weight 0.65g. Also, the unequal wedges in class 4c. How are they unequal - shape, size, angle or a combination. Thanks.

But Spink says 4c has a narrower crown and drapery of 2 unequal wedges which I thought described the picture below which I have taken from the Vosper website. The crown in the Vosper picture has the left and right hand projections pointing between Y & B and E & D whereas mine points to the base of Y & D. North says 4c has a crown less spread with smaller lettering, but without having both in the hand it is impossible to say as you don't know the measurements. However, the Vosper piece suggests S1433A(N1046/1) even though it is listed as S1433 which would mean mine couldn't be 4c. I would have said the abbreviation was a crescent rather than a comma. At no point does Coincraft mention a narrower crown.

That just looks like a double cut 6. It is testament to the die sinker's capabilities that more characters are not doubly cut given that at least a couple hits per letter with the punch would be quite normal. Also, going back a hundred years or more, characters were frequently constructed from several punches eg. E can be made from L and F

I used to collect all the bun pennies I could find before they went out of circulation, then one day I went into a shop to buy some stamps for my collection and saw an uncirculated sixpence which I liked and bought that too. I've still got it, and won't be getting rid because it has no bagmarks at x15 - didn't realise how good it was at the time. Now I look for items on dealers' lists, in auctions and on ebay, though all need to be approached with a bit of healthy scepticism as all are trying to put the best possible light on the item being sold. You can't beat looking at a coin in the flesh with a good magnifying device for a minute or two however good the picture or reputation of the seller/auction house, and don't be afraid to say no.

It could be just a flaw from a damaged die or a tiny piece of trapped metal which has been incorporated into the coin. The grade is too low to show the detail properly. you really need a minimum amount of disturbance to the original design to say for certain what it is and even then it is not always obvious. You need to look for an example in good VF or preferably better.

This is the relevant bit of Davies which shows the 3 types of obverse found on the 1920 half crown

If anyone has an example of an Anne trial halfpenny types Peck 708-712 (similar to Nicholson lots 155-157), could they please get in touch. Thanks.

I was rather remiss. The wide date 1876 F325 913+K*) 1/2d pictured earlier in this thread is 6 over a farthing punch 6 but I hadn't noticed the top of the 6 sticking out despite having had this coin for ages. Michael Freeman has just listed one on ebay which prompted me to check mine.

sounds like metal polish to me

Polo or Extra Strong?

Does anyone on this forum have an 1868 shilling die number 34? If so please PM me. Thanks.

Help please, can't decide whether it is E1 or E2. I think it is class 11a, but want a second opinion. Canterbury mint.

North is non-commital on this saying merely that E2 is as E1 which of course gives both EDWA R and EDWAR R as possibilities. Hawkins does the same.

Thank you Geordie. PS the title said penny

I'm not sure there is one. Serious variety collectors tend to collect one or two denominations at most. The cost of collecting all varieties in all denominations is a bit prohibitive and also coin collectors are a bit secretive. For varieties, you will have to plough through a number of books. Generally speaking, the standard references are Spink and Coincraft as these 2 publications give the broadest coverage for date and variety. However, they are both deficient in various ways. Spink doesn't list enough varieties having only some proofs and a handful of patterns but does cover every currency type. The prices are updated on a yearly basis and are an approximate reflection of the real world if a trifle expensive. Many varieites are simply listed as extremely rare with no price info shown. Coincraft has not been produced since 2000 and so prices are nonsensical, but it does have a better list of varieties and covers 1066 onwards. For more info regarding varieties the standard works for base metal are English Copper, Tin and Bronze coins in the British Museum (otherwise known as Peck - the author) 40 years old but indispensible. The last addition to this was an addendum in the 1967 British Numismatic Journal, so a lot has been discovered since then. Freeman is the other main reference but again is incomplete and only covers bronze pennies, halfpennies and farthings from 1860 onwards plus a few patterns for the proposed decimal currency prior to 1860. Gouby covers pennies in greater detail and there are other older publications such as Batty, Montagu et al but the first 2 are the most important, covering most people's needs. Silver coins are covered by English Silver Coinage since 1649 by Rayner, last revised in 1992 but still with a lot of holes. Davies' - British Silver Coins since 1816 does what it says on the cover and is reasonably complete with varieties. More so than ESC, but rather narrow in date range. Hammered is covered by North and sovereigns etc. are covered by Marsh. Both give good variety info. Other info can be extracted from auction catalogues where reference is frequently made to unrecorded varieties which in the absence of updates to books remain "unrecorded". Most people compile their own list specific to their personal field of interest. Colin Cooke's list of farthings on the website is not complete and he was in the process of compiling a definitive farthing guide before his untimely demise. I think he said it was up to Queen Anne. I have my own list of halfpennies which is now in excess of 1500 varieties and I haven't read all the books yet. I also have a virtually complete list of all known half-crowns. I haven't started on the shillings yet. None of these are on the web or even on computer. It is a case of buying the books and doing it yourself, although there may be some other members of this forum who have computerised lists they may be willing to share.

The double florin (4/-) issued between 1887 and 1890 has never been demonetised and therefore is still legal tender. Theoretically it could be spent today in a shop at face value of 20 pence, though having a value to collectors of many times this, you would be a fool to do so and you would probably get a strange look. Your question is therefore not valid.

Gotta give this one a little credit. Perhaps he is referring to the base-metal content of the crown, which in German would be kuper-nikel. You may have a point there. I suppose I had better apologise fully for any insinuated thoughts. Never mind, there will always be another one along soon.

Now we have gone up-market to a 1953 King's Norton Crown

It gets better. The errors were pointed out and the problem is quote THANKS ROB. BLOODY AUTO LIST MANAGER TOOL. CHANGED TO MANUAL MUCH SAFER. REGARDS RICH Clearly you can't trust computers these days. They insert wrong dates, wrong monarchs, changed George VI's wife's name to Mary or changed William's to George and to cap it all it appears that the coin is now cupro-nickel and a VIP proof!! - with more emphasis on the cupro than the nickel if the washed out colours are anything to go by. Must be the computer's fault. I wonder what the original coin was with the initial description? I don't normally use emoticons, but I wish there was one with a sad look shaking it's head. Do these people really exist or is someone just taking the p***????????????????

Spink 2006 prices are VF 50p, EF £6 and UNC £30, fine is unpriced. These values seem a bit high compared to what is available on various lists. In fine it will be worth pence, though I doubt you could sell it as there is no shortage of low grade 20th century bronze. Suitable references for prices are Spink's annual Standard Catalogue of British Coins and Collector's Coins published by the owner of this forum. There is an on-line price equivalent of these books which although it is not very comprehensive giving just the year and grade for various denominations and doesn't appear at first sight to specify any varieties, could provide some insight. It is written by someone called Tony Clayton. Type in coin prices + UK into Google and it is the 1st or 2nd entry.

Ask Mark Rasmussen for pictures, it was his list 7 cover coin. Alternatively I can scan in an image if required, but I guess you had better ask his permission before using it.

Title has been revised from this. Item: MARY & GEORGE 1694 HALFPENNY GVLIELMVS ERROR (8357295804) to the revised description. Any takers? - or perhaps that is a rhetorical question.