Merthyr Tydvil 1811 silver 1/- token.

[Guest Aidan Work]

I have had a very fascinating silver 1/- token that I would like to get identified.I bought it off a late friend of mine back in 2000 for NZ$2! It could be a scarce piece.

The obverse has a trophy of arms (cannon,flags,drum,& cannon balls) with the familiar symbol of the Prince of Wales feathers & coronet above it.The letters 'I.D' is just above a ground line on the left hand side near some cannon balls.

The reverse has '*MERTHYR* 5TH. SEP 1811' outside a circle.The inscription 'WALES & BRISTOL' is inside the circle.

I have seen photos of 1/- tokens from Bristol with this reverse,but an obverse depicting buildings of some sort or another.

This unusual piece to me suggests that it is from Merthyr Tydvil,south Wales,because of the presence of the Prince of Wales feathers.

If you have any information about this piece,including any clues as to how scarce,rare,or common it may be,please can you leave a posting here?

Aidan.

[Chris Perkins]

The reverse with 5TH SEP 1811 and WALES AND BRISTOL as you describe, is only listed with the building type, as number D5 or D6 under MERTHYR (Glamorganshire) in Daltons 'The silver Token Coinage 1811-12'. Under Bristol the Prince of Wales obverse occurs on number D37.

So, you've got one with a Britsol listed Prince of Wales plume side, and a Glamorganshire listed text side.....Which doesn't mean it's rare, I'm sure they swapped dies around just for the sake of it, and as Dalton was originally written in 1922, there may well have been new discoveries since.

PM me and I'll email you the email address of Dr Sriro, Conder expert.

[Chris Perkins]

Reply from Dr Sriro, Conder token expert:

Morning Chris. The fellow has a silver or silver plated Bank Token. These were issued after the Conder token period, and therefore there is nothing more I can add. There is or was a book on these 1811 - 1814 bank tokens up on eBay, but I can't find it now.

(so it would appear to be something struck at a later date using the obverse of one and the reverse of another)

[Guest Aidan Work]

Chris,my token is a very worn example,but it is definitely a silver piece.I'd be very surprised if it turns out to be a mule.I don't believe that it was struck after the token era.

Whatever it is,I'm not selling it.

Aidan.

[Chris Perkins]

I don't think you can call it a mule as such, because after the useful period for conder tokens I think quite a few were made especially for collectors and no doubt using different obv/rev combinations.

[Guest Aidan Work]

If I had a digital camera,plus the skills to upload photos,I'd be able to show you the piece in question.I've had it kicking around at home in a 2x2 holder for a few years.

Aidan.