Hairlines on milled silver

[ChKy 61]

do not mind the abbreviation PF or PR. There were no such proof coins of this coin type issued...

[Coinery 1,013]

Yet another TPGC cock-up!

[Peckris 579]

It is the same coin indeed. You can see that by comparison of the toning

No, I didn't mean it literally. I meant "not the same coin" in the sense of the original photograph is misleading. In other words you thought you were getting the coin as it looked in the seller's photograph, which of course it wasn't.

[ChKy 61]

It is the same coin indeed. You can see that by comparison of the toning

No, I didn't mean it literally. I meant "not the same coin" in the sense of the original photograph is misleading. In other words you thought you were getting the coin as it looked in the seller's photograph, which of course it wasn't.

AHHHHHH got the point language can be so simple... sometimes it is not...

[Peckris 579]

It is the same coin indeed. You can see that by comparison of the toning

No, I didn't mean it literally. I meant "not the same coin" in the sense of the original photograph is misleading. In other words you thought you were getting the coin as it looked in the seller's photograph, which of course it wasn't.

AHHHHHH got the point language can be so simple... sometimes it is not...

C'est vrai, n'est-ce pas?

[ChKy 61]

It is the same coin indeed. You can see that by comparison of the toning

No, I didn't mean it literally. I meant "not the same coin" in the sense of the original photograph is misleading. In other words you thought you were getting the coin as it looked in the seller's photograph, which of course it wasn't.

AHHHHHH got the point language can be so simple... sometimes it is not...

C'est vrai, n'est-ce pas?

Nix verstehen...

You may contact me in English, German aaaannnnnnddd...... Greek. Like your Prince Phillip, I have German and Greek roots too. In contrast to that I do not speak the language of diplomats (French in this case)

[ChKy 61]

I would like to add that example. Here a German 100 Euro commemorative coin 2002 offered for auction. It was graded PR70

http://coins.ha.com/itm/germany/world-coins/germany-federal-republic-gold-proof-100-euro-2002-a-pr70-ultra-cameo-ngc-/a/231450-62174.s

Needless to say that German 100 Euro commemorative coins were never minted & released in proof A first strike is a top grade of course, but still no proof (Polierte Platte)!

Yet another TPGC cock-up!

And I got a reply. An employee of Heritage auctions claimed of course, that this particular coin IS a proof coin.

He refered to certain literature (eg Krause Mishler and the Austrian coin magazine Money Trend), which claims that the 100 Euro coin was minted in proof only.

I told him that this statement is wrong in my opinion and advised him to consider references published in Germany and specialized onto German coinage (mainly Jaeger or Schön respectively, additionally I could have mentioned the magazines MünzenRevue and Münzen & Sammeln as well). In addition I adviced him to contact the official issuing office in Germany. I got no response after that of course. I do not expect any further or changed answer. The short-term financial concerns are too important I guess.

I did not tell him, that I am working in the coin business as well and handle that kind of coins on daily bases. They all were business strikes of course and I never had a proof in hand.

I won´t change their mind anyhow. At least I know where I can buy the coins of my personal interest.

[Rob 3,106]

I would like to add that example. Here a German 100 Euro commemorative coin 2002 offered for auction. It was graded PR70

http://coins.ha.com/itm/germany/world-coins/germany-federal-republic-gold-proof-100-euro-2002-a-pr70-ultra-cameo-ngc-/a/231450-62174.s

Needless to say that German 100 Euro commemorative coins were never minted & released in proof A first strike is a top grade of course, but still no proof (Polierte Platte)!

Yet another TPGC cock-up!

And I got a reply. An employee of Heritage auctions claimed of course, that this particular coin IS a proof coin.

He refered to certain literature (eg Krause Mishler and the Austrian coin magazine Money Trend), which claims that the 100 Euro coin was minted in proof only.

I told him that this statement is wrong in my opinion and advised him to consider references published in Germany and specialized onto German coinage (mainly Jaeger or Schön respectively, additionally I could have mentioned the magazines MünzenRevue and Münzen & Sammeln as well). In addition I adviced him to contact the official issuing office in Germany. I got no response after that of course. I do not expect any further or changed answer. The short-term financial concerns are too important I guess.

I did not tell him, that I am working in the coin business as well and handle that kind of coins on daily bases. They all were business strikes of course and I never had a proof in hand.

I won´t change their mind anyhow. At least I know where I can buy the coins of my personal interest.

There are probably more coins slabbed as proofs than the mints have ever combined. Prooflike and proof are frequently confused by the US TPGs, or at least they have difficulty with British coins. I suspect this extends to many world coins.

[ChKy 61]

There are probably more coins slabbed as proofs than the mints have ever combined. Prooflike and proof are frequently confused by the US TPGs, or at least they have difficulty with British coins. I suspect this extends to many world coins.

There are no proof and no proof like German 100 Euro Gold coins around. These are business strike coins. I see them every day, these coins have special surface safety features. Only business strike coins own these features, proof coins do not...

[Rob 3,106]

Fine. I accept your word on that. I was just commenting on the US TPG propensity to slab a lot of things as proofs when they aren't. The trouble is that you never know if it is a genuine cock-up or misguided belief. I have no reason to think that the true US mint definition of proof is any different to the UK's, France's or Germany's etc.