CGS Again

[ozjohn 552]

Looking through today's Ebay listings I came across this item CGS UIN 30853 Ebay Item# 111612758697 which is a 1930 halfcrown graded CGS 80. Looking at the obverse picture in both CGS and Ebay I could see the coin has 3 dig marks in a line on the side of the head between the King's eyebrow and the top of his ear. These are not bag marks

as they are too regular and deep. How does a coin as damaged as this get a grading of 80 therefore increasing its potential price to a collector. The more I see of CGS the less confidence I have in their ability to grade coins correctly. A few days a go I was asking if a gothic crown was genuine and one correspondent suggested CGS to check its authenticity. In all honesty I think they would be the last people I would consult.

[jacinbox 36]

soon we have to all become like the big auction houses and ask for CGS coins to be unholdered so that they can be examined prior to purchase

[jacinbox 36]

absolutely disgraceful

[Peter 615]

Edge knocks spring to mind...

[numismatist 2]

Thought they didn't grade " damaged " Coins

Last two similar 1930's through DNW were GEF £400 and Virtually as struck £350

I would have thought you would be lucky to get 25% to 35% of that asking price from a Dealer ?

[Nick 325]

Looking through today's Ebay listings I came across this item CGS UIN 30853 Ebay Item# 111612758697 which is a 1930 halfcrown graded CGS 80. Looking at the obverse picture in both CGS and Ebay I could see the coin has 3 dig marks in a line on the side of the head between the King's eyebrow and the top of his ear. These are not bag marks as they are too regular and deep. How does a coin as damaged as this get a grading of 80 therefore increasing its potential price to a collector.

Not sure I agree. The three marks look just the right width and distance apart to have been caused by a direct edge to face collision between two halfcrowns. Either way though, it's definitely not worth £1,350.

[sound 25]

I think this just highlights the descriptive superiority of the traditional method. It's so simple ' surface marks left of kings face, apart from that Uncirculated'. Much superior to 'CGS 80' whatever that means IMO.

Of course buyer and seller can determine price following an honest description.

Mark

Edited March 4, 2015 by sound

[damian1986 142]

Well i'm losing interest, everyone's asking a fortune whether it's a problem coin entombed or a real quality piece that's going on commission. Just spotted a Philip & Mary 6d going for £4,500, it's a reasonable coin considering the issue but meh come on. Not so sure 2014 was the best time to begin forming a collection if it's gonna cost X days wages to pick up some early/mid 20th century silvers in a decent grade.

Okay so it's a stupid price to ask but what happens when the next 5 CGS-graded mediocre coins make their way onto fleabay at a silly price and no alternatives are available to commerce?, someone pulls the trigger on one eventually.

Whinge whinge whinge, I know I know.

[Rob 2,998]

I don't understand P&Ms. They aren't rare, or at least some aren't, but invariably go for silly money. I used to have one in gVF which was a bit short, so sold it as I couldn't live with it given most are full. Lo and behold the price then rocketed, to the extent that I couldn't even buy a VF one for what I sold it for. I know the facing busts are a novelty and it is unusual to have a foreign monarch on a British coin, but these prices are simply dumb.

[azda 973]

I have a P&M 6d, twas a metal detecting find and the finder wanted to sell as soon as he found it. Its not brilliant but it is an example

[CartwheelTwopence 2]

I've considered buying one, but as you said the price is very off putting.

[Paulus 1,942]

I think any problem free Phil and Mary in Fine + with eye appeal (my MINIMUM criteria) are a silly price, one of the reasons I concentrate on a milled type collection. Likewise tin farthings.

[ozjohn 552]

Nick. Jet propelled halfcrowns?

[Peter 615]

P&M's float my boat and I will end up with a nice example.

Being a reformed coinie I am concentrating on types and leaving my early copper on the back burner.

I can't specialize like Rob as the funds/library/nouse are not there.

[Rob 2,998]

P&M's float my boat and I will end up with a nice example.

Being a reformed coinie I am concentrating on types and leaving my early copper on the back burner.

I can't specialize like Rob as the funds/library/nouse are not there.

Me, specialising...............in diversity The ultimate oxymoron.

[Paulus 1,942]

P&M's float my boat and I will end up with a nice example.

Being a reformed coinie I am concentrating on types and leaving my early copper on the back burner.

I can't specialize like Rob as the funds/library/nouse are not there.

Me, specialising...............in diversity The ultimate oxymoron.

I'm guessing that Peter might mean that you collect 'specialist' varieties such as different moneyers for different mints for early hammered??

I'm interested though ... for your own personal collection what are your main focus areas Rob?

As an aside, the word 'oxymoron' often amuses me, as people who don't know what it means sometimes have a slightly 'offended' reaction when one uses it

Edited March 5, 2015 by Paulus

[Rob 2,998]

I don't have a main focus area. That's the point of the collection. Anything which offers variation in design is acceptable from Celtic through to the present, but although I try not to duplicate, sometimes it is necessary to have different years with the same basic design. e.g. the maundy reverses are essentially unchanged for nearly two centuries, but occur with a reamped obverse every time the monarch is replaced.

I will confess to being unable to completely break up the Soho G3 halfpenny section and so only disposed of approx.30 pieces with the aim of having an example of each Peck type (DH1, DH2 etc). The cast -offs were examples in different metals of the same design.

[Paulus 1,942]

Well I would class 'different numismatic designs from Celtic through to the present' as an area of focus ... I must admit I enjoy your posts of pics from your collection as they are often appealing examples of rarer designs / types, accompanied by a fascinating 'back story', relating to provenance or history

Edited March 5, 2015 by Paulus

[Rob 2,998]

It's not that simple. An idea of the target together with approximate numbers to each section is as follows:

Persons in whose name a coin was struck, including the episcopal issues. - 250

Denominations - 130

Metals used including the various degrees of fineness or debasement - 50

Examples of an attributed designer' handiwork - 190 (This is the one with the largest prospect for expansion)

Initial or privy mark including overmarks - 330

Mint locations - 150

Miscellaneous which includes errors, metal sources, minting techniques etc. - 90

This list makes some sections difficult to complete without duplication, and in some case impossible. eg. the 26 new designers used for the Olympic 50ps are on coins with the same basic obverse as are most of the decimal issues. There are a number of mints which only existed for a short time which coincided with historical events. These will also be impossible to complete without duplication.

[Paulus 1,942]

Ummm ... that certainly highlights some differences in what you and I collect ...

[Peter 615]

Some of the coins Robs collects have a bloody lot of research behind them and the work obviously will pay dividends.

Each to their own.I can't resist a Bury St Eds mint hammered.

I appreciate Robs work on IDing quality rare coins which will now be around for future collectors and part of our history.

I do have Roman coins with tickets over 110 years old.

I try and ID/record all my coins so my daughters will benefit.

My aim this year is to pick off a few quality coins and cease on reckless buying.

[copper123 1,352]

More yap yap yap on slabs , yawn

[damian1986 142]

More yap yap yap on slabs , yawn

The conversation moved away from that to P&M and then Rob's collection so the thread did pretty well in the end no?

Anyway the odd whinge is good for the soul

[copper123 1,352]

It is a well troden suject on these boards though, isn't it .

Lets let sleeping slabs lie, LOL, basicly they just seem to upset everyone on here.

[Peter 615]

I do like a nice slab of sirloin medium rare.

The thread here was about double standards of slabbing.

It needs policing because there is a conflict of interests.

When big sums of £ on a grade there is greed about.

Obviously too tempting for some TPG's