More Pennies

[Nordle11 564]

Also, the A in VICTORIA is clogged, but I doubt that's what you were talking about!

[secret santa 2,013]

yep, this is one of the BP1860P to V range. I believe it to be BP1860V with re-entered colon dots, one of the later stages of modification because there is almost no rim beyond the teeth - something I have found to be the case on the final stages of the range. Take a look at my pics on the website below. Although Gouby thought that the colon dots were re-entered, I have my doubts about this as there are so many variations in the size and distance apart of the "re-entered" colon dots. I haven't developed an alternative theory yet though, so I'll still refer to them as re-entered.

[jacinbox 36]

57 minutes ago, Bernie said:

The colon dots do appear to be close after F:D  ??

Yes similar to lot 16 http://www.colincooke.com/collections/james_workman_pt1.html

Quoting CC "BMC --. F--. Satin --. Similar to Gouby T but with re entered colon dots of which are smaller and much closer together, similar to those used on halfpennies. Unrecorded in any catalogues. Excessively rare, possibly unique."

Since the sale has this become a recognised variety? Interesting halfpenny colon dots. Perhaps the colon dots were re-entered after all  but accidentally used a halfpenny colon instead.

 

Edited March 4, 2016 by jacinbox

[jacinbox 36]

37 minutes ago, secret santa said:

yep, this is one of the BP1860P to V range. I believe it to be BP1860V with re-entered colon dots, one of the later stages of modification because there is almost no rim beyond the teeth - something I have found to be the case on the final stages of the range. Take a look at my pics on the website below. Although Gouby thought that the colon dots were re-entered, I have my doubts about this as there are so many variations in the size and distance apart of the "re-entered" colon dots. I haven't developed an alternative theory yet though, so I'll still refer to them as re-entered.

Santa after looking at your site one can say that the obv is similar the one shown below with close colon dots

Edited March 4, 2016 by jacinbox

[terrysoldpennies 691]

2 hours ago, jacinbox said:

Santa after looking at your site one can say that the obv is similar the one shown below with close colon dots

Hi Jerry / Richard .  This is a type I've been looking at for some time now . I have found two 1860 coins, both as usual freeman 4+d , but slightly different from other types that I have seen. The first has the halfpenny colons like the penny above , but closer, and are larger in size like the normal colons .  The other has wide set colons extending into the outer line, and rotated sharply, to a greater extent than the 1860 satin 20. There arrangement is identical to the 1861 satin 28a . Now the odd thing is that both were obtained from Australia , was this a coincidence, or perhaps a batch of pennies, all being of this modified die type were shipped out to Aussie in the 19th c.   Maybe the no colon dies were sent out, recut and coins milled out there.  Terry

[terrysoldpennies 691]

Pics

[Nordle11 564]

Alan sent me a picture via email to share, of an 1865/3 but with a dot under the Y. He is interested if anyone else has an example like this.

[Prax 80]

I have seen this dot below Y before. However it's been on a 1870 penny.

Edited March 8, 2016 by Prax

[Nordle11 564]

That's what I said, although the dot is a little closer to the Y, picture attached.

[Prax 80]

On 21/02/2016 at 4:26 PM, Prax said:

Rich, Just spotted my 5+D ONF. Apologies for the delay

Sometime back we discussed the ONF (4+D) pennies. This specimen (http://www.londoncoins.co.uk/?page=Pastresults&auc=152&searchlot=2364&searchtype=2) is a clear case of both the E's (on ONE and PENNY) wearing down. On the 4+Ds both the Es have been re-cut at some point. However on the 5+D the E in PENNY is strong and hence has not been recut. If anyone comes across a 4+D with the Es showing-up as ONF and PFNNY respectively then please share a snap; I would be really interested. It's also intriguing to note the E over P happens on 4+D. Are these linked? Who knows?

Edited March 8, 2016 by Prax

[Prax 80]

7 minutes ago, Nordle11 said:

That's what I said, although the dot is a little closer to the Y, picture attached.

Aha yes that's the bunny Matt.

Edited March 8, 2016 by Prax

[Prax 80]

 

In response to all the messages I''ve received about the 1934 penny I thought perhaps I should post this information on this thread for the benefit of all. First off, Terry, congratulations on the 2 no wave 1934s that you possess, it’s a fairly rare coin. The coin I gave for grading is not the one from ‘The Workman Sale’. Mine is the 3^rd coin that I am aware of for this variety. Here is a list of all the 1934 no wave pennies that I know of

a)      Workman sale Part II lot 107 (XF) – fetched £500 + bidder premium (25^th Nov 2010)

b )     A forum member (perhaps Scott?) has a 1934 no waves penny on his Omni site (VF) – no price info (2011) - http://www.omnicoin.com/coin/996048

c)       My coin acquired from The Lymington Saleroom (VF) - £400 (2013)

d)      Terry’s specimen (VF ) – no price info (acquired ???)

e)      Terry’s specimen (XF ) – no price info (acquired ???)

The UINs for the coins I gave to have slabbed are as follows,  though I’d doubt the pictures have been fed into the database yet

0038916 – 1875 Cannon Ball – F http://www.coingradingservices.co.uk/?uin=0038916&page=coin_verification&Submit=Verify

0038917 – 1862 VIGTORIA – Fair http://www.coingradingservices.co.uk/?uin=0038917&page=coin_verification&Submit=Verify

0038918 – 1934 No Waves – VF http://www.coingradingservices.co.uk/?uin=0038918&page=coin_verification&Submit=Verify

PS : My holiday season starts in a week or so and I won’t be able to respond in timely fashion. But drop me a mail for anything urgent and I will respond when I am in a wi-fi hotspot, which could be once a week or so. Enjoy.

Edited March 11, 2016 by Prax

[Nordle11 564]

Thanks for sharing Prax, nice little write up.

The pictures are already showing on the website as well.

[PWA 1967 1,841]

Thanks Prax.

I have seen a couple and the workman sale was one.

Will find the other and put a link up when i find it again........if i find it.

I didnt really see a premium price....... but obviously wrong and now some people are looking maybe some more may turn up.

The Vi..G..toria from memory i think Gary had one but may be wrong again .

Pete.

Edited March 11, 2016 by PWA 1967

[secret santa 2,013]

Prax, do you have that sort of information on other/all rare coins ? It's the sort of thing I was trying to pull together for the rare coin census.

[terrysoldpennies 691]

2 hours ago, Prax said:

 

In response to all the messages I''ve received about the 1934 penny I thought perhaps I should post this information on this thread for the benefit of all. First off, Terry, congratulations on the 2 no wave 1934s that you possess, it’s a fairly rare coin. The coin I gave for grading is not the one from ‘The Workman Sale’. Mine is the 3^rd coin that I am aware of for this variety. Here is a list of all the 1934 no wave pennies that I know of

a)      Workman sale Part II lot 107 (XF) – fetched £500 + bidder premium (25^th Nov 2010)

b )     A forum member (perhaps Scott?) has a 1934 no waves penny on his Omni site (VF) – no price info (2011) - http://www.omnicoin.com/coin/996048

c)       My coin acquired from The Lymington Saleroom (VF) - £400 (2013)

d)      Terry’s specimen (VF ) – no price info (acquired ???)

e)      Terry’s specimen (XF ) – no price info (acquired ???)

The UINs for the coins I gave to have slabbed are as follows,  though I’d doubt the pictures have been fed into the database yet

0038916 – 1875 Cannon Ball – F http://www.coingradingservices.co.uk/?uin=0038916&page=coin_verification&Submit=Verify

0038917 – 1862 VIGTORIA – Fair http://www.coingradingservices.co.uk/?uin=0038917&page=coin_verification&Submit=Verify

0038918 – 1934 No Waves – VF http://www.coingradingservices.co.uk/?uin=0038918&page=coin_verification&Submit=Verify

PS : My holiday season starts in a week or so and I won’t be able to respond in timely fashion. But drop me a mail for anything urgent and I will respond when I am in a wi-fi hotspot, which could be once a week or so. Enjoy.

Thanks Prax.  I perhaps gave the wrong impressions of the grades, one is Fine the other is near EF , I said  VF/EF.  This is the best one, though I think its been cleaned    Terry

[secret santa 2,013]

Lovely example, Terry.

[scott 129]

I got one in EF lol

Edited March 11, 2016 by scott

[terrysoldpennies 691]

26 minutes ago, scott said:

I got one in EF lol

seems to be more coming out of the woodwork all the time , it will be common soon  Terry

[Prax 80]

On 11/03/2016 at 9:28 AM, secret santa said:

Prax, do you have that sort of information on other/all rare coins ? It's the sort of thing I was trying to pull together for the rare coin census.

Not on all the rare pennies but a few. I will fetch my notes and send it over to you but I am sure you will find it quite dated.

[Nonmortuus 848]

I am just after a second opinion please. I bought a small job lot of pennies that were all in a pretty bad way purely becuase I thought I had spotted an ok grade 1902 low tide. This is what came today along with an 1882 H washer and a few other badly worn pennies. Am I right in thinking its a low tide?

[jacinbox 36]

6 minutes ago, Nonmortuus said:

I am just after a second opinion please. I bought a small job lot of pennies that were all in a pretty bad way purely becuase I thought I had spotted an ok grade 1902 low tide. This is what came today along with an 1882 H washer and a few other badly worn pennies. Am I right in thinking its a low tide?

Yes low tide!

[IanB 175]

IMO it is. The tide is below the junction where the legs meet.

hope I have that right

[Nonmortuus 848]

Excellent! Thank you both for the confirmation. I picked up the lot for £27 delivered on the assumption this was a mid grade low tide. This was also in there along with another 10 or so worn Victoria pennies and a couple of Geroge V and Elizabeth II pennies. I know its in a very low grade but this was the coin the seller was raving about not the 1902:

Edited March 17, 2016 by Nonmortuus

[Nordle11 564]

Good spot Non, definitely LT and worth the price paid