Jump to content
British Coin Forum - Predecimal.com

50 Years of RotographicCoinpublications.com A Rotographic Imprint. Price guide reference book publishers since 1959. Lots of books on coins, banknotes and medals. Please visit and like Coin Publications on Facebook for offers and updates.

Coin Publications on Facebook

   Rotographic    

The current range of books. Click the image above to see them on Amazon (printed and Kindle format). More info on coinpublications.com

predecimal.comPredecimal.com. One of the most popular websites on British pre-decimal coins, with hundreds of coins for sale, advice for beginners and interesting information.

Recommended Posts

4 hours ago, 1949threepence said:

One thing's for sure. If I had been after it, and was the winner, I sure as hell wouldn't want it sent "£2.50 economy". Would have to be tracked next day delivery for an item of that rarity and value. 

In fairness to the seller Mike ,when i bought one from him i did send a message asking the same as the coin was a few quid.Although i could not understand his reply he did send it Special delivery and i did receive it the day after :) .

Edited by PWA 1967
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Where does this seller get all his pennies and varieties from, I wonder??  Like many on this forum, I guess, I have seen the sheer number and scope of his coins over the last couple of years and it is simply astonishing how he keeps turning up the rare types of penny in particular! He sure isn't buying them on eBay! Given too English is not this seller's first language, fair do's that he can research all the subtleties and nuances in Freeman or Gouby. I'm a bit jealous of his "magical penny tree" to misquote our beloved PM!!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Martinminerva said:

Where does this seller get all his pennies and varieties from, I wonder??  Like many on this forum, I guess, I have seen the sheer number and scope of his coins over the last couple of years and it is simply astonishing how he keeps turning up the rare types of penny in particular! He sure isn't buying them on eBay! Given too English is not this seller's first language, fair do's that he can research all the subtleties and nuances in Freeman or Gouby. I'm a bit jealous of his "magical penny tree" to misquote our beloved PM!!

 

I believe he goes to most shows and auctions ,so hat off to him as obviously keeps busy :) A dealer was telling me he used to just buy foreign ,but when he saw how much some other coins were going for started looking at everything.

Edited by PWA 1967

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, PWA 1967 said:

I believe he goes to most shows and auctions ,so hat off to him as obviously keeps busy :) A dealer was telling me he used to just buy foreign ,but when he saw how much some other coins were going for started looking at everything.

He is exceptional, I must admit. If he really is attending and/or logging in to that many fairs and auctions, then fair play to the guy. That is dedication, especially given, as Martin says, English is obviously not his first language. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm hoping that he doesn't get too clued up on medals and tokens. I buy a few bits from him for stock and get good deals.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

true but there are so many that are ambiguous there is a "G over an O " farthing 1822 listed at the moment which is obviously a squash to the bar and down spike, of course the books can tell us things that is not to say we always learn or we learn how to slowly apply pressure onto a piece of metal until it looks right, I am not suggesting this has happened by his hand of course.  I purchased a 56 farthing from him and I am certainly going to go back and look, it was an E over an R I am going to post the images but I think it has been tooled.  The problem is you get things and are so excited to have one in the collection that you just overlook things at times ....Do you know I think I have been conned the R has been tooled I think and then aged it is a pretty fabulous job the work if it is is highly skilled the R's on many farthing run into each other along the bottom bar and this has been squashed flatter which you can only see once the coin in angled .  YOur opinions please 

CM180724-113502010 (243x400).jpg

CM180724-115326001 (400x243).jpg

CM180724-115452004 (259x400).jpg

CM180724-115616007 (243x400).jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, 1949threepence said:

He is exceptional, I must admit. If he really is attending and/or logging in to that many fairs and auctions, then fair play to the guy. That is dedication, especially given, as Martin says, English is obviously not his first language. 

yes that is as maybe but could you take a look at the above 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, PWA 1967 said:

I believe he goes to most shows and auctions ,so hat off to him as obviously keeps busy :) A dealer was telling me he used to just buy foreign ,but when he saw how much some other coins were going for started looking at everything.

have a look at this E over R 1856 for me I am thinking it is wrong 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, DrLarry said:

true but there are so many that are ambiguous there is a "G over an O " farthing 1822 listed at the moment which is obviously a squash to the bar and down spike, of course the books can tell us things that is not to say we always learn or we learn how to slowly apply pressure onto a piece of metal until it looks right, I am not suggesting this has happened by his hand of course.  I purchased a 56 farthing from him and I am certainly going to go back and look, it was an E over an R I am going to post the images but I think it has been tooled.  The problem is you get things and are so excited to have one in the collection that you just overlook things at times ....Do you know I think I have been conned the R has been tooled I think and then aged it is a pretty fabulous job the work if it is is highly skilled the R's on many farthing run into each other along the bottom bar and this has been squashed flatter which you can only see once the coin in angled .  YOur opinions please 

CM180724-113502010 (243x400).jpg

CM180724-115326001 (400x243).jpg

CM180724-115452004 (259x400).jpg

CM180724-115616007 (243x400).jpg

 

G over O 1821 Larry, not 22. I have an EF+ example myself. A recognised variety though, as to what is actually showing under the G, the jury is still out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Michael-Roo said:

 

G over O 1821 Larry, not 22. I have an EF+ example myself. A recognised variety though, as to what is actually showing under the G, the jury is still out.

yes sorry , It was just the coin that the seller is selling it was off the top of my head having seen it yesterday.  the same seller who has been on the last few replies also sold me this E over R 1856 farthing and I am now thinking it is not right 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

this one 

s-l500 (1) (399x400).jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CP1858 Large rose with small date

 

1858LRObv.jpg

1858LRRev.jpg

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Chingford said:

CP1858 Large rose with small date

 

1858LRObv.jpg

1858LRRev.jpg

I was really happy with this one as purchased a while ago not attributed as a large rose in an auction.They are quite scarce in any grade ,so to send it to cgs for Freya and it come back as 80 was a bonus.

Makes looking and searching worthwhile sometimes :) .

Pete.

Edited by PWA 1967
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As you say Pete scarce, especially so in such a high grade. Remind me Pete, I believe there are 3 varieties of this, all with the 8 either over a 3  a 7 or possible over a 9?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, IanB said:

As you say Pete scarce, especially so in such a high grade. Remind me Pete, I believe there are 3 varieties of this, all with the 8 either over a 3  a 7 or possible over a 9?

 

No....Ian.

There are not any known obvious overdates on the large rose.,just small date and large date.The one you are thinking of is the one you bought off me that maybe over something but cant be certain what.

Edited by PWA 1967

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for clearing that up Pete, so is the small date the one to be looking for?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
59 minutes ago, PWA 1967 said:

No....Ian.

There are not any known obvious overdates on the large rose.,just small date and large date.The one you are thinking of is the one you bought off me that maybe over something but cant be certain what.

The last 8 in the date of both types look to have been reworked and are rather messy, but neither is an obvious overdate. At this time the Mint were using up old working dies and a larger number of altered dies are from this period

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, PWA 1967 said:

http://www.londoncoins.co.uk/?page=Pastresults&searchterm=1858+Large+Rose&searchtype=1

Either size date are scarce ,so doesnt really matter ,obviously the rose is on the reverse :)

If you look at LOT 2652 & LOT 1810 its the same Large date as you have and the description notes,underlying figure.

So my one is as they call it "the companion piece" to your one. If only my one was as high a grade as yours, that would make a decent double act.

Will be keeping my eyes open for oneB)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, PWA 1967 said:

https://www.dnw.co.uk/auction-archive/lot-archive/lot.php?department=Coins&lot_id=311875

I was lucky to find this Lot at DNW a few months ago 🙂

If you get bored maybe have a look as one is scarce and dont think many spotted it on the day.

Pete.

Couple of nice 1851's, Pete..........

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, 1949threepence said:

Couple of nice 1851's, Pete..........

Thanks Mike 🙂

The reason for me buying the Lot though was the one top left is the scarce one.

The REV is different than any other year and one sold last week in LCA for £2600+ premium. its now on Richards site as a pattern with NO Colon after REG ,the sheild ,leaves ,stem and other differences.

Not many about so was really happy to spot this one and was able to get rid of the others to help cover the cost.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, PWA 1967 said:

Thanks Mike 🙂

The reason for me buying the Lot though was the one top left is the scarce one.

The REV is different than any other year and one sold last week in LCA for £2600+ premium. its now on Richards site as a pattern with NO Colon after REG ,the sheild ,leaves ,stem and other differences.

Not many about so was really happy to spot this one and was able to get rid of the others to help cover the cost.

Ah, well spotted, Pete. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/27/2018 at 12:09 PM, Chingford said:
On 7/27/2018 at 11:03 AM, PWA 1967 said:

No....Ian.

There are not any known obvious overdates on the large rose.,just small date and large date.The one you are thinking of is the one you bought off me that maybe over something but cant be certain what.

The last 8 in the date of both types look to have been reworked and are rather messy, but neither is an obvious overdate. At this time the Mint were using up old working dies and a larger number of altered dies are from this period

Many of them have the reworked/overstruck 8 as John says which Bramah recorded as 25c. My own specimen (large date) has this plus the 1 over 1 and all numerals double struck.

288859798_1858P1517largedatelargerosezoom2.JPG.eeead0d7f4a8649cdb7b5eb424266bbd.JPG

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, secret santa said:

Many of them have the reworked/overstruck 8 as John says which Bramah recorded as 25c. My own specimen (large date) has this plus the 1 over 1 and all numerals double struck.

288859798_1858P1517largedatelargerosezoom2.JPG.eeead0d7f4a8649cdb7b5eb424266bbd.JPG

 

Not double struck - I would say the whole date has been repunched. We do know from the sheer number of 1858 varieties that dies were used and re-used, most likely  to save costs ahead of a planned conversion to bronze in 1859 (postponed for a year and a half). I have that 'doubled' date but not 1 over 1. The absence of doubling anywhere else I think proves that it was a recut date purely to prolong die use.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×