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New Ebay Fee Structure

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But your claiming from eBay, not RM. As long as you've got the receipts etc. then eBay/Paypal would give the refund and the I guess it's up to them to recuperate the lost monies?

That's a sweeping statement. Only time will tell if eBay/Paypal are willing to honour that. I wouldn't want to claim as a test case because they would be certain to fight a claim as far as possible in case they set a precedent for paying out. How many times are Paypal or eBAy known to have sided with a seller. We all have examples of where the buyer gets his money, but far more interesting would be those where his claim is rejected. Knowing you are in the right is not the same as getting eBay's support.

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I'm having problems with a seller in Poland, bought the coins and paid same day with PayPal as advertised in the listing. Seller refuses Paypal but has not refunded, and demands I send him bank transfer at my expense :angry: I rang ebay, they just said I need to wait a month before I can raise a case against him. They were nice coins, suspect the selling price was not as much as he hoped for

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Ebay and paypal, both are shite and do as they please.

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Ebay and paypal, both are shite and do as they please.

I've never had a problem with PayPal so far, touch wood.

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Ebay and paypal, both are shite and do as they please.

I've never had a problem with PayPal so far, touch wood.

One of the things that is not generally known...If the buyer has less than a 50 feedback, then the insurance from eBay/Paypal is only $200, not the value of the merchandise! Also there is a $25 deductable, so if you sold a coin for $3000, and the buyer had only 46 feedback, then you would receive $175 (200-25), for loss of the coin!...surprise..... :)

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Just to let you know,another master class in the shafting of users;


New policy around early ended auctions


As announced earlier this year, if you end an auction early after it has been listed for more than 24 hours and buyers have already placed bids, you will be charged a fee. This fee is the same as a final value fee, based on the highest bid price when you ended the auction.


We’ve previously waived this fee for your first early ended auction with bids every calendar year. We’re now revising this so that instead, we’ll waive the fee for any auctions cancelled within 24 hours of listing. This is regardless of whether your auction has received bids. We’re doing this because we realise sometimes you might need to take down an auction you’ve listed.


We’ll also still waive the fee if we have to end your auction early for any reason.


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In another section it says something to the effect that you only get one free pass per year. Finish any more sales early and you will pay. (Unless of course you're a huge revenue spinner, in which case - do whatever you want)

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Another useless act by eBay is allowing buyers to rate sellers for postage charges whilst retaining their anonymity. This deprives the seller of the ability to ban some buyers on the grounds they object automatically to 'excessive' charges. Because most people who use eBay are complete tw*ts that are out of touch with reality, they have no concept of the costs incurred for distribution. When the wife sells she normally charges £3.00 for cheap items or £8.00 special delivery.

For that £3 charge you have £1.83 second class signed for to protect yourself against the fraudsters, jiffy bag £0.10 and the cost of printing an invoice £0.05. As a VAT registered business you have to add the 20% to shipping charges, so that comes to £2.37. Add in a trip to the post office, which costs the company a mileage charge of 45p per mile for private car use on company business and the total is £3.27 for a single item trip.

Sell an item starting and finishing at £1 and you will receive £3.26 after eBay's FVF fee of 10% on everything (£0.40) plus the Paypoo fee of £0.34. Great. So they expect you make a loss on everything that sells for a quid yet have the cheek to tell you that your postage charges are too high and that buyers expect free postage these days.

Unfortunately life as a business has a cost which ultimately the consumer has to bear. So if all those idiot buyers, not to mention idiot eBay policymakers, who think postage should be zero or at royal mail cost would extricate their head and expose it to some sunshine, maybe we could all operate on the same wavelength. :angry: Yes, I am p'd off.

Edited by Rob

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I was just reading yesterday on the BBC News app that Southebys are teaming up with ebay somehow so they can hit a wider audience becaise their recent online auctions have done well, but why ebay, they just sell shite and have idiots who don't pay. Can you imagine the negative feedbacks from their postage :D

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I dont know why everyone has a downer on ebay. As a buyer I like it. I like Paypal as well. In fact I wont buy anything unless I can pay via paypal.

All you small want-to-be coin dealers should look at your business model and act accordingly. If Ebay doesn't meet your needs then find another global sales medium (if you can), otherwise stick to coin fairs, local markets, car boots and Chris's for sale forum. Dont forget to look at your actual costs when using these other mediums.

Rob your 45p mileage figure is misleading. That is the personal expenses allowance that the HMRC allows you for using your own car on company business for the first 10,000 miles (unless you're an MP, then its 78p per mile).

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I dont know why everyone has a downer on ebay. As a buyer I like it. I like Paypal as well. In fact I wont buy anything unless I can pay via paypal.

All you small want-to-be coin dealers should look at your business model and act accordingly. If Ebay doesn't meet your needs then find another global sales medium (if you can), otherwise stick to coin fairs, local markets, car boots and Chris's for sale forum. Dont forget to look at your actual costs when using these other mediums.

Rob your 45p mileage figure is misleading. That is the personal expenses allowance that the HMRC allows you for using your own car on company business for the first 10,000 miles (unless you're an MP, then its 78p per mile).

And the coins are bought and sold through the business, hence the pricing has to include VAT and mileage allowance which is a cost to the business. Obviously taking two parcels to the PO will halve this element, but doesn't negate the fact that you effectively have to give away an item if it sells for a pound. The point I'm making is that selling to the public has to include VAT and as a business you have to cover your costs. Unfortunately eBay's recommended method of selling has taken a leaf out of the Gordon Brown/Ed Balls/Labour Party school of accountancy with a one sided balance sheet that only reads income without any allowance for costs. If we can't all make a butty, the party which is losing out will run away.

I can throw things in the bin for free and the council will collect. I can (and do) scrap coppers, bronze, brass, silver etc as this generates net cash without having to worry about eBay/paypal. Many times the amount sold gets melted because there isn't the market to absorb this quantity amongst collectors. Very simply, unless you can persuade buyers to bid to the sort of level you would get on the table at a fair, scrapping offers a better return.

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I dont know why everyone has a downer on ebay. As a buyer I like it. I like Paypal as well. In fact I wont buy anything unless I can pay via paypal.

All you small want-to-be coin dealers should look at your business model and act accordingly. If Ebay doesn't meet your needs then find another global sales medium (if you can), otherwise stick to coin fairs, local markets, car boots and Chris's for sale forum. Dont forget to look at your actual costs when using these other mediums.

Rob your 45p mileage figure is misleading. That is the personal expenses allowance that the HMRC allows you for using your own car on company business for the first 10,000 miles (unless you're an MP, then its 78p per mile).

I can throw things in the bin for free and the council will collect. .

But lets not forget, Rob and Aardhawk, even when Rob dös Throw those coins out and the Council collects it, its still costing Rob money because he pays Council tax for the pleasure of his refuse to be collected. So you see Aardhawk NOTHING comes for free

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I was never suggesting that anything was for free. What I was say was, that a business needs a sustainable business model. In fact in the UK it has a statutory duty to run at a profit. If you cant make a profit selling 99p items then dont sell them. Find something else to sell.

Rob, the business determines what level of expenses it will refund its employees for motoring expenses incurred up to a maximum of 45p for the first 10,000 miles and then 20p (or so) thereafter. This money comes out of profits earned and is payed by the company tax free to the individual before company corporation tax is levied. It has no impact on your prices charged. If the company isnt making a profit them it cant reimburse expenses. You could always reduce motoring expenses to 5p per mile and tell your employee to only go to the post office once a week to reduce costs. You could always ditch your accountant if your turn over is less than £250k (it may be more now). That'll save your company a grand or two a year. I never used an accountant for the last two companies I traded through.

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I was never suggesting that anything was for free. What I was say was, that a business needs a sustainable business model. In fact in the UK it has a statutory duty to run at a profit. If you cant make a profit selling 99p items then dont sell them. Find something else to sell.

Rob, the business determines what level of expenses it will refund its employees for motoring expenses incurred up to a maximum of 45p for the first 10,000 miles and then 20p (or so) thereafter. This money comes out of profits earned and is payed by the company tax free to the individual before company corporation tax is levied. It has no impact on your prices charged. If the company isnt making a profit them it cant reimburse expenses. You could always reduce motoring expenses to 5p per mile and tell your employee to only go to the post office once a week to reduce costs. You could always ditch your accountant if your turn over is less than £250k (it may be more now). That'll save your company a grand or two a year. I never used an accountant for the last two companies I traded through.

Eh? You're trying to tell me it's against the law for a UK business to make a loss??

Ok, I plead guilty. Bring the handcuffs round now.

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A majority of people who sell Coins on eBay are'nt businesses, they are merely people who think they've inherited the most fantastic coins, coin collectors would call them washers.

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What Aardhawk means it that it is illegal for a business to trade with liabilities greater than assets on the balance sheet. This is where the murky area of intangibles pops its ugly head above the parapet in times of trouble. The P&L can operate at either a profit or a loss as long as it doesn't create an excess of liabilities as above. Hence writing down goodwill (essentially overpaying for an asset) can have fatal consequences for a business in the worst cases.

As for the question of whether it is 45p or whatever is irrelevant. The important thing for any business is that a job must be fully costed to assess viability. Whether you decide to cross-subsidise with a parallel operation is discretionary, but it is best that you ensure any operation is stand-alone viable, because somewhere along the line it will have to be. That is part and parcel of a business model being self-sustaining. All this started because I moaned about eBay saying that postage charges were too high, yet equally say you should start lots at 99p. They also expect you to send by signed for postage. All this adds up to doing everything at no, or very little cost, to which the various parties concerned have not signed up. These are the cost which I highlighted earlier.

If you have to pay the minimum eBay fee of 35p to list an item which sells for £1, eBay's take of the £4 total rises to £1.09, or up from a minimum 19% to over 27%, with the balance and more being absorbed by incurred expenditure. A wonderful way of paying to dispose of all those stock items which didn't cost you a penny to acquire (if the numbers are to have any hope of balancing).

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Looks like I will be going Umbrella on my next project (I wound up my Ltd company at the pleading of my accountant...IR35)

The Government seem intense on stopping people making a good living WITHIN THE LAW to pay Jeremy Kyle stars.

My last 3 years of trading I had paid nearly £40k corporation tax.

Rob is right in claiming 45p mile to post items.Within the law.

I went to work for a contractor who recently let employees have car allowance rather than a company car.

They weren't aware of the tax benefits they could claim the difference between the 11p(contractor was paying) and 45p entitled to.

The 40% tax bracket payers were very pleased with me. :rolleyes:

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What Aardhawk means it that it is illegal for a business to trade with liabilities greater than assets on the balance sheet. This is where the murky area of intangibles pops its ugly head above the parapet in times of trouble. The P&L can operate at either a profit or a loss as long as it doesn't create an excess of liabilities as above. Hence writing down goodwill (essentially overpaying for an asset) can have fatal consequences for a business in the worst cases.

As for the question of whether it is 45p or whatever is irrelevant. The important thing for any business is that a job must be fully costed to assess viability. Whether you decide to cross-subsidise with a parallel operation is discretionary, but it is best that you ensure any operation is stand-alone viable, because somewhere along the line it will have to be. That is part and parcel of a business model being self-sustaining. All this started because I moaned about eBay saying that postage charges were too high, yet equally say you should start lots at 99p. They also expect you to send by signed for postage. All this adds up to doing everything at no, or very little cost, to which the various parties concerned have not signed up. These are the cost which I highlighted earlier.

If you have to pay the minimum eBay fee of 35p to list an item which sells for £1, eBay's take of the £4 total rises to £1.09, or up from a minimum 19% to over 27%, with the balance and more being absorbed by incurred expenditure. A wonderful way of paying to dispose of all those stock items which didn't cost you a penny to acquire (if the numbers are to have any hope of balancing).

Well yes - that's essentially bankruptcy. If that's what was meant, I'd have understood straight away.

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Well yes - that's essentially bankruptcy. If that's what was meant, I'd have understood straight away.

No its ceasing trading.

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Well yes - that's essentially bankruptcy. If that's what was meant, I'd have understood straight away.

No its ceasing trading.

You can't trade and cease trading all at the same time.

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Is this the 5 minute argument or the full half hour? :D

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No you haven't

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He has you know

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Well yes - that's essentially bankruptcy. If that's what was meant, I'd have understood straight away.

No its ceasing trading.

You can't trade and cease trading all at the same time.

Technically you cease trading and go into voluntary liquidation. There used to be a very good company north of the river who could arrange this for you, if you'd pissed it all up against a wall.

Peter, umbrellas (aka managed service companies (these days)) are not the answer for IT contractors. You will fall under the IR35 regs whether or not you plan on being there for two years or less). You need to buy an off the shelf ltd company, with two shares issued (£30 + £2). Register for VAT and flat rate vat and run your own payee scheme and file to do company tax returns all via your Government Accoiunt. This will take you no more than 30 minutes online. Pay yourself £968 per month and take dividends for yourself and company secretary. Run a spread sheet to keep a track of incoming and out goings and pay your NI, payee and act each month using the HMRC website. You dont need an acct. You are doing all the work anyway so why give it to a firm of accounts for doing nothing. Don't feed the beast. Aardhawk, IBM mainframe contract AP (retd) for the last 30 years.

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