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Also picked up this nice card counter

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39 minutes ago, will1976 said:

Also picked up this nice card counter

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Very nice ! I find this series fascinating, with regards to the widely accepted theory that there was no "Bishop's Wine Cellar" and that these were fantasies of 19th century pub checks. Is the "2" in "Bottle 2/11" overpunched ? 

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26 minutes ago, JLS said:

Is the "2" in "Bottle 2/11" overpunched ? 

Both two's are blundered but I don't think it's an over punch. Looking at it closely (×40 magnification) I'm starting to think it might be an upside down 7 punch along with another to make up a 2. Possibly an altered 9 punch?

I'm currently looking for the articles from TCSB to read up on

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2 hours ago, will1976 said:

Both two's are blundered but I don't think it's an over punch. Looking at it closely (×40 magnification) I'm starting to think it might be an upside down 7 punch along with another to make up a 2. Possibly an altered 9 punch?

I'm currently looking for the articles from TCSB to read up on

Plausible theory. It's probably of Scottish origin given that it shares the obverse die of Mr. Wylie's Classes (V27) ? Don't know of any English token with this obverse die. 

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10 hours ago, JLS said:

Very nice ! I find this series fascinating, with regards to the widely accepted theory that there was no "Bishop's Wine Cellar" and that these were fantasies of 19th century pub checks. Is the "2" in "Bottle 2/11" overpunched ? 

I like the Colonial bit probably Australia or S A colonies.

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A new acquisition for the unofficial farthing collection...despite the rather fancy style, Seaber is presumed to have been a total failure in business (or to have died shortly after opening up shop) because his establishment didn't last long enough to be recorded in any directory etc. 

The tokens are therefore pretty rare !

1seaber.JPG.f9c5d6bd8655d2a201d71a59628e2f54.JPG1seaber2.JPG.40336aa5e2929b15d5e6955e8e50d2e2.JPG

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A little light reading for the lockdown.......

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Both those titles look like great reading.

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43 minutes ago, Peckris 2 said:

Both those titles look like great reading.

The one on the left is definitely an excellent read - I bought it around ten years ago...the section about the Soho mint's involvement in the Russian coinage is particularly fascinating. 

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5 hours ago, will1976 said:

A little light reading for the lockdown.......

20200411_163916.jpg

Both available from Amazon at a very good price. 

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Latest purchase......this leaves just one in the Birmingham series to find. This piece is ex Jan collection

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1 hour ago, will1976 said:

Latest purchase......this leaves just one in the Birmingham series to find. This piece is ex Jan collection

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Very nice ! 

Interesting to see the contemporary context of the Workhouse on the street (vs. how it's portrayed on the workhouse's own 19th century tokens) - assuming the two buildings either side of it are not part of the enlargement...

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Just looking through stuff I put away a few years ago and came across 1788 Imitation Spade Guinea by Wilmore Alston & Co and wondered if it was rare as cannot seem to find another on the internet, do not have BHM but did find a 1/2 guinea.

 

 

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1 hour ago, JLS said:

Interesting to see the contemporary context of the Workhouse on the street

I'm assuming the buildings on the left and right are nothing to do with the work house as the token is from the late 1790's and they're not depicted on the 1812 tokens I've seen. If they where part of the enlargement surely they would of been included on the later tokens? 

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47 minutes ago, rooneydog said:

Just looking through stuff I put away a few years ago and came across 1788 Imitation Spade Guinea by Wilmore Alston & Co and wondered if it was rare as cannot seem to find another on the internet, do not have BHM but did find a 1/2 guinea.

 

 

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Yes, this is a relatively early imitation spade guinea and fairly rare; listed by Neilson as number 2960. I wouldn't rate the value much in that grade as you do get nice ones with original gilding occasionally, but it's not an easy piece to find. 

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24 minutes ago, will1976 said:

I'm assuming the buildings on the left and right are nothing to do with the work house as the token is from the late 1790's and they're not depicted on the 1812 tokens I've seen. If they where part of the enlargement surely they would of been included on the later tokens? 

Not so sure about that as I've seen several "idealized" pictures of the workhouse corresponding just to the buildings on 1812 tokens from far later...by the Victorian period the complex was enormous. I may have a bit more of a research. 

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5 minutes ago, JLS said:

Yes, this is a relatively early imitation spade guinea and fairly rare; listed by Neilson as number 2960. I wouldn't rate the value much in that grade as you do get nice ones with original gilding occasionally, but it's not an easy piece to find. 

Thank you - I thought it was contemporary after reading an article from BNJ

 

1. Contemporaneous issues. These retained the official designs and legends and bore genuine dates of issue corresponding to those of the actual coins, viz. 1787-97 and from one issuer 1798. About a dozen Birmingham firms struck and issued them, and in most cases signed them with names or initials (which were their own1 —not the bogus initials found on the 'evasion' counterfeit halfpennies and farthings made during this period). Most were of brass. To avoid confusion with the gold prototypes, some had scalloped edges or were undersized and/or made of copper.

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2 minutes ago, rooneydog said:

Thank you - I thought it was contemporary after reading an article from BNJ

 

1. Contemporaneous issues. These retained the official designs and legends and bore genuine dates of issue corresponding to those of the actual coins, viz. 1787-97 and from one issuer 1798. About a dozen Birmingham firms struck and issued them, and in most cases signed them with names or initials (which were their own1 —not the bogus initials found on the 'evasion' counterfeit halfpennies and farthings made during this period). Most were of brass. To avoid confusion with the gold prototypes, some had scalloped edges or were undersized and/or made of copper.

Yes, you're right, it's part of the "first series" along with the Kettle issues etc. I don't know if it would have actually been struck in 1788 or a few years after, but it definitely is Georgian rather than Victorian. 

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1 hour ago, JLS said:

Not so sure about that as I've seen several "idealized" pictures of the workhouse corresponding just to the buildings on 1812 tokens from far later...by the Victorian period the complex was enormous. I may have a bit more of a research

The trouble for me at the moment is that with living at work I have none of my books to hand to look things up. I could very well be wrong but have no way of checking! 

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Blimey, well done, which one have you still to acquire? I have a few still to get, including the Workhouse one.

I've just upgraded my St Martin's Church example:

1797_hp_warwickshire_birmingham_st_martins_church_dh_154_02_ref_02043_02_sellers_druids_revenge_2400.jpg

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1859 halfpenny

c1611-1859 halfpenny rev.A no dots.jpg

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1858/6 halfpenny

c1487-1858 over 6 halfpenny altered date.jpg

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1858-largerose-with-zoom--large.thumb.jpg.74124555cd521c288eac7f4053c80e83.jpg

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