An Interesting 1898 Penny

[davidrj 194]

Not sure on this one - trying to image 1898 pennies with the variant final eights

What do folk here think of the sea level on the right hand coin?

Edited October 17, 2013 by davidrj

[scott 129]

it is the same height, the problem with the 2nd one is the die looks to be on its last legs.

Edited October 17, 2013 by scott

[Colin G. 147]

I agree with Scott, if you look at the number of border beads until you reach the horizon, they are the same, however the sea on the example to the right dips down as it approaches Britannia's ankle, probably as a result of die polishing/wear.

[Accumulator 52]

I have to agree that they both look the same, based on the position of the sea against the border beads.

[Coinery 926]

Agreed but, taking a closer look at the point 5 beads down from the tip of the toe, does the bottom (straight) line of the waves pass over the bead in one image, and into it in another? Of course, grade would be king in verifying that, but could be something for those with lots of pennies and penny experience to verify or reject!

[josie 8]

The right coin have a much detail ankle and cloth is more clear and the ankle is curve compare to the left..

Edited October 17, 2013 by josie

[davidrj 194]

Agreed but, taking a closer look at the point 5 beads down from the tip of the toe, does the bottom (straight) line of the waves pass over the bead in one image, and into it in another? Of course, grade would be king in verifying that, but could be something for those with lots of pennies and penny experience to verify or reject!

Thanks all, think you are right - an optical illusion, looked very real in hand

I agree there is a very slight difference with respect to alignment with border beads, see exergue line and sea behind Britannia - nowt of real significance though, possibly slight difference in overall size of britannia, suspect reduction processes produced slight variations

[Coinery 926]

Agreed but, taking a closer look at the point 5 beads down from the tip of the toe, does the bottom (straight) line of the waves pass over the bead in one image, and into it in another? Of course, grade would be king in verifying that, but could be something for those with lots of pennies and penny experience to verify or reject!

Thanks all, think you are right - an optical illusion, looked very real in hand

I agree there is a very slight difference with respect to alignment with border beads, see exergue line and sea behind Britannia - nowt of real significance though, possibly slight difference in overall size of britannia, suspect reduction processes produced slight variations

You must be due to find a biggie!

[Peter 615]

The right coin have a much detail ankle and cloth is more clear and the ankle is curve compare to the left..

Welcome back Josie.

[AardHawk 73]

I think that the 8 is different. Different pointing. Different shape.

Any chance that we can have a close up of the rest of the date?

Also, welcome back Josie.

[josie 8]

Thank you to all.

I do visit here from time to time from minimum to rarely but not logging in,as most elders advice in life keep going on.

[davidrj 194]

I think that the 8 is different. Different pointing. Different shape.

Any chance that we can have a close up of the rest of the date?

Also, welcome back Josie.

you are right, it was the eights i was studying when I was distracted by the sea level, the left hand coin has the variant 8 (Gouby 1898B)

My study of OH penny reverses is ongoing, the halfpennies are interesting too and largely ignored.

Edited October 18, 2013 by davidrj

[davidrj 194]

the three types of 1898 penny found so far

the terminal 8s are all distinct

has anyone here got a cache of lower grade old head pennies they want to dispose of? tended to chuck old heads back as boring when i was pulling buns out of circulation

Edited October 18, 2013 by davidrj

[Accumulator 52]

has anyone here got a cache of lower grade old head pennies they want to dispose of? tended to chuck old heads back as boring when i was pulling buns out of circulation

I've got plenty of them and I'd be happy to look through for something specific if it helps? I'd rather hold onto the coins though.

[davidrj 194]

I've got plenty of them and I'd be happy to look through for something specific if it helps?

looking for more 1898s and 1895s so far found 3 varieties of 1895, the 2mm all appear identical but hard to find spares of the 1mm with intact border beads

date differences on the 1mm quite striking, but is there a slight difference in the relationship of the drapery, waves and rocks to the union flag on the shield?? scans done together at roughly the same orientation

Edited October 18, 2013 by davidrj

[davidrj 194]

I've got plenty of them and I'd be happy to look through for something specific if it helps?

looking for more 1898s and 1895s so far found 3 varieties of 1895, the 2mm all appear identical but hard to find spares of the 1mm with intact border beads

date differences on the 1mm quite striking, but is there a slight difference in the relationship of the drapery, waves and rocks to the union flag on the shield?? scans done together at roughly the same orientation

correction lighting from the opposite direction shows NO difference in the 2 1mm reverses - top image is a 2mm

still looking for another wide date(s)

[RLC35 288]

I've got plenty of them and I'd be happy to look through for something specific if it helps?

looking for more 1898s and 1895s so far found 3 varieties of 1895, the 2mm all appear identical but hard to find spares of the 1mm with intact border beads

date differences on the 1mm quite striking, but is there a slight difference in the relationship of the drapery, waves and rocks to the union flag on the shield?? scans done together at roughly the same orientation

correction lighting from the opposite direction shows NO difference in the 2 1mm reverses - top image is a 2mm

still looking for another wide date(s)

David,

It looks like the 1mm examples (bottom two pics) have the 5 located at a different location in reference to the edge tooth! One is right over the tooth, and one is to the side of the tooth(gap).

Edited October 19, 2013 by RLC35

[davidrj 194]

yes Bob I know there is a date difference, I was looking to see if there were any other die differences, this is only wide date 1895 recorded as far as I'm aware

my error above was not first checking different lighting on the same coins, a problem especially with lustred examples, much prefer to work with nice chestnut toned EF bronze when variety spotting

David

[Peckris 579]

I've got plenty of them and I'd be happy to look through for something specific if it helps?

looking for more 1898s and 1895s so far found 3 varieties of 1895, the 2mm all appear identical but hard to find spares of the 1mm with intact border beads

date differences on the 1mm quite striking, but is there a slight difference in the relationship of the drapery, waves and rocks to the union flag on the shield?? scans done together at roughly the same orientation

correction lighting from the opposite direction shows NO difference in the 2 1mm reverses - top image is a 2mm

still looking for another wide date(s)

David,

It looks like the 1mm examples (bottom two pics) have the 5 located at a different location in reference to the edge tooth! One is right over the tooth, and one is to the side of the tooth(gap).

Yes, that's exactly what I spotted too - the 5 is to a different pointing entirely.

[Peter 615]

Try CDESTEVES'S sources for bulk buys.

He is the treasure bag ebay seller.

I gave the majority of my VH's to local schools and got rid of huge bags at a car boot (we did once).

The ones I've got left I will check.

This reminds me of the great surveys and variety write ups that coin monthly produced.

[Accumulator 52]

I've got plenty of them and I'd be happy to look through for something specific if it helps?

looking for more 1898s and 1895s so far found 3 varieties of 1895, the 2mm all appear identical but hard to find spares of the 1mm with intact border beads

date differences on the 1mm quite striking, but is there a slight difference in the relationship of the drapery, waves and rocks to the union flag on the shield?? scans done together at roughly the same orientation

correction lighting from the opposite direction shows NO difference in the 2 1mm reverses - top image is a 2mm

still looking for another wide date(s)

David,

It looks like the 1mm examples (bottom two pics) have the 5 located at a different location in reference to the edge tooth! One is right over the tooth, and one is to the side of the tooth(gap).

I've been through my 1895's and all are the 1mm trident and narrow date. Nothing very exciting there! I pulled out any 2mm examples long ago. I'd temporarily forgotten, but of course the 2mm die also has a much lower sea level. Here are my best examples:

[Accumulator 52]

[davidrj 194]

I've been through my 1895's and all are the 1mm trident and narrow date. Nothing very exciting there! I pulled out any 2mm examples long ago. I'd temporarily forgotten, but of course the 2mm die also has a much lower sea level. Here are my best examples:

Nice 2mm. There are other differences too, alignment of letters with border beads and a shorter trident.

There are only 3 basic reverse types (though lots of varieties) for the bronze penny

A: Ship & lighthouse - Bun pennies 1860-1894 (34 yrs)

B: Just Britannia - old head Vic, Ed VII, George V 1895-1936 (41 yrs)

C: Lighthouse - George VI & Eliz 1937-1970

My view is that each series should be treated together for die identification, rather than splitting into reigns

Edited October 20, 2013 by davidrj

[Accumulator 52]

I've been through my 1895's and all are the 1mm trident and narrow date. Nothing very exciting there! I pulled out any 2mm examples long ago. I'd temporarily forgotten, but of course the 2mm die also has a much lower sea level. Here are my best examples:

Nice 2mm. There are other differences too, alignment of letters with border beads and a shorter trident.

There are only 3 basic reverse types (though lots of varieties) for the bronze penny

A: Ship & lighthouse - Bun pennies 1860-1894 (34 yrs)

B: Just Britannia - old head Vic, Ed VII, George V 1895-1936 (41 yrs)

C: Lighthouse - George VI & Eliz 1937-1970

My view is that each series should be treated together for die identification, rather than splitting into reigns

I've never really thought of it like that, but the 3-category split does make sense.

[Peckris 579]

I've been through my 1895's and all are the 1mm trident and narrow date. Nothing very exciting there! I pulled out any 2mm examples long ago. I'd temporarily forgotten, but of course the 2mm die also has a much lower sea level. Here are my best examples:

Nice 2mm. There are other differences too, alignment of letters with border beads and a shorter trident.

There are only 3 basic reverse types (though lots of varieties) for the bronze penny

A: Ship & lighthouse - Bun pennies 1860-1894 (34 yrs)

B: Just Britannia - old head Vic, Ed VII, George V 1895-1936 (41 yrs)

C: Lighthouse - George VI & Eliz 1937-1970

My view is that each series should be treated together for die identification, rather than splitting into reigns

I've never really thought of it like that, but the 3-category split does make sense.

Well, I would split the B into pre-1927 and post-1927 (B1 and B2?) - but I think it's a good principle.