How much shite?

[azda 973]

This sort of BS is what drives me away from American auction houses, talking up coins the way they do, there's really no need for all the schmazzzz ma tazzzz associated with what is a plain 1853 sixpence. HERITAGE, give it a break...................Here is their description of an 1853 sixpence, starting price is a whopping $1000 with an estimate of $2000 See how many metaphors you can pick out. All that's missing from this is a fricking billboard and flashing lights and if it hits the top end it will be 1000 GBP OVER Spinks UNC price guide

Victoria Sixpence 1853, Young Head, S-3908, KM733.1, MS68 PCGS, just splendid, in fact one of the best English silver coins of any type we have seen, with intense luster, super-bold details, flawless surfaces, a flashy snow-white brilliant reverse with a hint of golden iridescent hues, and an obverse sheathed in an exquisite blend of golden blue iridescence. Pristine! From The Kairos Collection

Edited April 13, 2013 by azda

[TomGoodheart 373]

LOL Goldberg's beat Heritage hands down on that front in my opinion. How about this for a very double struck hammered shilling?

"Great Britain. Charles I (1625-49) silver Shilling (1643-44). S-2843. Tower Mint issue, under Parliament (1642-48). "P" in brackets mm (Spink #98, struck 1643-44). Extremely elusive variety, the first time this cataloguer has ever seen this peculiar mintmark on a superior coin! The standard catalogue describes this issue as "coarse work" and that is clearly an understatement, for the die-work here is almost comical. The reason, of course, is that the talent escaped London with the king at almost the same moment this very coin was struck. The king was under threat of life and Crown even at the outset of the Civil War, when this coin was minted. He was as yet not disowned as Monarch, however, and the weak Parliament which preceded Cromwell's rise to overlordship was the official issuer of this coin, or "in the king's name" as the saying went. If you understand this groundwork, this historical context, you must perforce be impressed by this extraordinary specimen! NGC graded MS62 but the cataloguer is at a loss to explain the number. The coin is clearly Choice and without wear, peering at it under magnification. The surfaces are original and elegantly toned a medium gray color. While crudely cut, the portrait is extraordinary, suggestive of the strife of its day; the king's bodice shows some fascinating little details, vague emblems of majesty. The shield is equally interesting and well struck. So too the legends, although they are only partial, some letters being off-flan because of its shape. The rarely seen mintmark is crisp in detail. At first glance this coin looks like nothing, a crude cobbling of elements. The more you study it, though, the more you realize it's a simply superb example of this emergency coinage, made at one of England's most horrific moments, outbreak of its disastrous Civil War, which when it ended in 1660 brought back a monarchy totally different in power and attitude from that which prevailed in 1643, when this coin was made, almost even then "in memory" of once-mighty kingship. "

I love the quibble about the NGC grading. But even so, Give It A Break!

[Coinery 926]

LOL Goldberg's beat Heritage hands down on that front in my opinion. How about this for a very double struck hammered shilling?

"Great Britain. Charles I (1625-49) silver Shilling (1643-44). S-2843. Tower Mint issue, under Parliament (1642-48). "P" in brackets mm (Spink #98, struck 1643-44). Extremely elusive variety, the first time this cataloguer has ever seen this peculiar mintmark on a superior coin! The standard catalogue describes this issue as "coarse work" and that is clearly an understatement, for the die-work here is almost comical. The reason, of course, is that the talent escaped London with the king at almost the same moment this very coin was struck. The king was under threat of life and Crown even at the outset of the Civil War, when this coin was minted. He was as yet not disowned as Monarch, however, and the weak Parliament which preceded Cromwell's rise to overlordship was the official issuer of this coin, or "in the king's name" as the saying went. If you understand this groundwork, this historical context, you must perforce be impressed by this extraordinary specimen! NGC graded MS62 but the cataloguer is at a loss to explain the number. The coin is clearly Choice and without wear, peering at it under magnification. The surfaces are original and elegantly toned a medium gray color. While crudely cut, the portrait is extraordinary, suggestive of the strife of its day; the king's bodice shows some fascinating little details, vague emblems of majesty. The shield is equally interesting and well struck. So too the legends, although they are only partial, some letters being off-flan because of its shape. The rarely seen mintmark is crisp in detail. At first glance this coin looks like nothing, a crude cobbling of elements. The more you study it, though, the more you realize it's a simply superb example of this emergency coinage, made at one of England's most horrific moments, outbreak of its disastrous Civil War, which when it ended in 1660 brought back a monarchy totally different in power and attitude from that which prevailed in 1643, when this coin was made, almost even then "in memory" of once-mighty kingship. "

I love the quibble about the NGC grading. But even so, Give It A Break!

Would certainly up their SEO if they haven't copied and pasted it from an Encyclopedia, that is! I might list a 1966 penny with a description like that, just for the email responses from bemused collectors worldwide!

[copper123 1,352]

The civil war ended in 1660 did it ?

I always thought this country was a republic for eleven or so years after charles's death but maybe i am wrong

[Peckris 579]

LOL Goldberg's beat Heritage hands down on that front in my opinion. How about this for a very double struck hammered shilling?

"Great Britain. Charles I (1625-49) silver Shilling (1643-44). S-2843. Tower Mint issue, under Parliament (1642-48). "P" in brackets mm (Spink #98, struck 1643-44). Extremely elusive variety, the first time this cataloguer has ever seen this peculiar mintmark on a superior coin! The standard catalogue describes this issue as "coarse work" and that is clearly an understatement, for the die-work here is almost comical. The reason, of course, is that the talent escaped London with the king at almost the same moment this very coin was struck. The king was under threat of life and Crown even at the outset of the Civil War, when this coin was minted. He was as yet not disowned as Monarch, however, and the weak Parliament which preceded Cromwell's rise to overlordship was the official issuer of this coin, or "in the king's name" as the saying went. If you understand this groundwork, this historical context, you must perforce be impressed by this extraordinary specimen! NGC graded MS62 but the cataloguer is at a loss to explain the number. The coin is clearly Choice and without wear, peering at it under magnification. The surfaces are original and elegantly toned a medium gray color. While crudely cut, the portrait is extraordinary, suggestive of the strife of its day; the king's bodice shows some fascinating little details, vague emblems of majesty. The shield is equally interesting and well struck. So too the legends, although they are only partial, some letters being off-flan because of its shape. The rarely seen mintmark is crisp in detail. At first glance this coin looks like nothing, a crude cobbling of elements. The more you study it, though, the more you realize it's a simply superb example of this emergency coinage, made at one of England's most horrific moments, outbreak of its disastrous Civil War, which when it ended in 1660 brought back a monarchy totally different in power and attitude from that which prevailed in 1643, when this coin was made, almost even then "in memory" of once-mighty kingship. "

I love the quibble about the NGC grading. But even so, Give It A Break!

Would certainly up their SEO if they haven't copied and pasted it from an Encyclopedia, that is! I might list a 1966 penny with a description like that, just for the email responses from bemused collectors worldwide!

"This 1967 penny is the finest we've ever seen - and we've seen many! Almost full iridescent lustre, this coin is virtually in the state it left the Mint in 1969. (Yes, note the historical drama - despite carrying the date 1967, this penny was actually minted in 1969 due to the quirky law passed by Great Britain's Chancellor, Jim Callaghan. This minting of a coin bearing the incorrect date was unprecedented since.. the year before). The generous size of these old pennies puts today's hastily struck minor coins into perspective. Remember - a 1967 penny is the last of its kind, redolent of that lost era between February and August 1971 when - already doomed - it and its peers could be seen gasping out the last weeks of their existence. This particular specimen is 100% guaranteed genuine, having been taken from a receipted Mint Sealed Bag which lay forgotten in the cellar of a 1960s coin dealer who went out of business in 1972. All the other specimens in the bag were damaged by environmental factors, but this miracle specimen emerged virtually unscathed and we offer it - slabbed and annotated - as an artefact of a lost age of coin collecting."

[Paulus 1,942]

LOL Goldberg's beat Heritage hands down on that front in my opinion. How about this for a very double struck hammered shilling?

"Great Britain. Charles I (1625-49) silver Shilling (1643-44). S-2843. Tower Mint issue, under Parliament (1642-48). "P" in brackets mm (Spink #98, struck 1643-44). Extremely elusive variety, the first time this cataloguer has ever seen this peculiar mintmark on a superior coin! The standard catalogue describes this issue as "coarse work" and that is clearly an understatement, for the die-work here is almost comical. The reason, of course, is that the talent escaped London with the king at almost the same moment this very coin was struck. The king was under threat of life and Crown even at the outset of the Civil War, when this coin was minted. He was as yet not disowned as Monarch, however, and the weak Parliament which preceded Cromwell's rise to overlordship was the official issuer of this coin, or "in the king's name" as the saying went. If you understand this groundwork, this historical context, you must perforce be impressed by this extraordinary specimen! NGC graded MS62 but the cataloguer is at a loss to explain the number. The coin is clearly Choice and without wear, peering at it under magnification. The surfaces are original and elegantly toned a medium gray color. While crudely cut, the portrait is extraordinary, suggestive of the strife of its day; the king's bodice shows some fascinating little details, vague emblems of majesty. The shield is equally interesting and well struck. So too the legends, although they are only partial, some letters being off-flan because of its shape. The rarely seen mintmark is crisp in detail. At first glance this coin looks like nothing, a crude cobbling of elements. The more you study it, though, the more you realize it's a simply superb example of this emergency coinage, made at one of England's most horrific moments, outbreak of its disastrous Civil War, which when it ended in 1660 brought back a monarchy totally different in power and attitude from that which prevailed in 1643, when this coin was made, almost even then "in memory" of once-mighty kingship. "

I love the quibble about the NGC grading. But even so, Give It A Break!

Would certainly up their SEO if they haven't copied and pasted it from an Encyclopedia, that is! I might list a 1966 penny with a description like that, just for the email responses from bemused collectors worldwide!

"This 1967 penny is the finest we've ever seen - and we've seen many! Almost full iridescent lustre, this coin is virtually in the state it left the Mint in 1969. (Yes, note the historical drama - despite carrying the date 1967, this penny was actually minted in 1969 due to the quirky law passed by Great Britain's Chancellor, Jim Callaghan. This minting of a coin bearing the incorrect date was unprecedented since.. the year before). The generous size of these old pennies puts today's hastily struck minor coins into perspective. Remember - a 1967 penny is the last of its kind, redolent of that lost era between February and August 1971 when - already doomed - it and its peers could be seen gasping out the last weeks of their existence. This particular specimen is 100% guaranteed genuine, having been taken from a receipted Mint Sealed Bag which lay forgotten in the cellar of a 1960s coin dealer who went out of business in 1972. All the other specimens in the bag were damaged by environmental factors, but this miracle specimen emerged virtually unscathed and we offer it - slabbed and annotated - as an artefact of a lost age of coin collecting."

I think I will list one Peck with your exact wording, just for the craic! (with your permission!)

[Peckris 579]

LOL Goldberg's beat Heritage hands down on that front in my opinion. How about this for a very double struck hammered shilling?

"Great Britain. Charles I (1625-49) silver Shilling (1643-44). S-2843. Tower Mint issue, under Parliament (1642-48). "P" in brackets mm (Spink #98, struck 1643-44). Extremely elusive variety, the first time this cataloguer has ever seen this peculiar mintmark on a superior coin! The standard catalogue describes this issue as "coarse work" and that is clearly an understatement, for the die-work here is almost comical. The reason, of course, is that the talent escaped London with the king at almost the same moment this very coin was struck. The king was under threat of life and Crown even at the outset of the Civil War, when this coin was minted. He was as yet not disowned as Monarch, however, and the weak Parliament which preceded Cromwell's rise to overlordship was the official issuer of this coin, or "in the king's name" as the saying went. If you understand this groundwork, this historical context, you must perforce be impressed by this extraordinary specimen! NGC graded MS62 but the cataloguer is at a loss to explain the number. The coin is clearly Choice and without wear, peering at it under magnification. The surfaces are original and elegantly toned a medium gray color. While crudely cut, the portrait is extraordinary, suggestive of the strife of its day; the king's bodice shows some fascinating little details, vague emblems of majesty. The shield is equally interesting and well struck. So too the legends, although they are only partial, some letters being off-flan because of its shape. The rarely seen mintmark is crisp in detail. At first glance this coin looks like nothing, a crude cobbling of elements. The more you study it, though, the more you realize it's a simply superb example of this emergency coinage, made at one of England's most horrific moments, outbreak of its disastrous Civil War, which when it ended in 1660 brought back a monarchy totally different in power and attitude from that which prevailed in 1643, when this coin was made, almost even then "in memory" of once-mighty kingship. "

I love the quibble about the NGC grading. But even so, Give It A Break!

Would certainly up their SEO if they haven't copied and pasted it from an Encyclopedia, that is! I might list a 1966 penny with a description like that, just for the email responses from bemused collectors worldwide!

"This 1967 penny is the finest we've ever seen - and we've seen many! Almost full iridescent lustre, this coin is virtually in the state it left the Mint in 1969. (Yes, note the historical drama - despite carrying the date 1967, this penny was actually minted in 1969 due to the quirky law passed by Great Britain's Chancellor, Jim Callaghan. This minting of a coin bearing the incorrect date was unprecedented since.. the year before). The generous size of these old pennies puts today's hastily struck minor coins into perspective. Remember - a 1967 penny is the last of its kind, redolent of that lost era between February and August 1971 when - already doomed - it and its peers could be seen gasping out the last weeks of their existence. This particular specimen is 100% guaranteed genuine, having been taken from a receipted Mint Sealed Bag which lay forgotten in the cellar of a 1960s coin dealer who went out of business in 1972. All the other specimens in the bag were damaged by environmental factors, but this miracle specimen emerged virtually unscathed and we offer it - slabbed and annotated - as an artefact of a lost age of coin collecting."

I think I will list one Peck with your exact wording, just for the craic! (with your permission!)

Feel free! (Don't mention me, though )

[jaggy 528]

This sort of BS is what drives me away from American auction houses, talking up coins the way they do, there's really no need for all the schmazzzz ma tazzzz associated with what is a plain 1853 sixpence. HERITAGE, give it a break...................Here is their description of an 1853 sixpence, starting price is a whopping $1000 with an estimate of $2000 See how many metaphors you can pick out. All that's missing from this is a fricking billboard and flashing lights and if it hits the top end it will be 1000 GBP OVER Spinks UNC price guide

Victoria Sixpence 1853, Young Head, S-3908, KM733.1, MS68 PCGS, just splendid, in fact one of the best English silver coins of any type we have seen, with intense luster, super-bold details, flawless surfaces, a flashy snow-white brilliant reverse with a hint of golden iridescent hues, and an obverse sheathed in an exquisite blend of golden blue iridescence. Pristine! From The Kairos Collection

I will admit to having a chuckle when I saw that description. The more so that the close up photo of the coin does not really match the hyperbole. As a sixpence collector, this and other coins in the auction do interest me. But the prices are completely over the top. Which is a shame as I would have been willing to drop a decent number of dollars at prices which more accurately matched what I believe to be the value of the coins. I have bid and won a few times at Heritage in their weekly internet auctions and, usually, the prices are more or less what one would expect. But this particular auction seems to be completely over the top. I don't know if this is due to unrealistic reserves being set by sellers or by an auction house trying to manipulate market prices. It will be interesting to see how much success they have.

[Coinery 926]

LOL Goldberg's beat Heritage hands down on that front in my opinion. How about this for a very double struck hammered shilling?

"Great Britain. Charles I (1625-49) silver Shilling (1643-44). S-2843. Tower Mint issue, under Parliament (1642-48). "P" in brackets mm (Spink #98, struck 1643-44). Extremely elusive variety, the first time this cataloguer has ever seen this peculiar mintmark on a superior coin! The standard catalogue describes this issue as "coarse work" and that is clearly an understatement, for the die-work here is almost comical. The reason, of course, is that the talent escaped London with the king at almost the same moment this very coin was struck. The king was under threat of life and Crown even at the outset of the Civil War, when this coin was minted. He was as yet not disowned as Monarch, however, and the weak Parliament which preceded Cromwell's rise to overlordship was the official issuer of this coin, or "in the king's name" as the saying went. If you understand this groundwork, this historical context, you must perforce be impressed by this extraordinary specimen! NGC graded MS62 but the cataloguer is at a loss to explain the number. The coin is clearly Choice and without wear, peering at it under magnification. The surfaces are original and elegantly toned a medium gray color. While crudely cut, the portrait is extraordinary, suggestive of the strife of its day; the king's bodice shows some fascinating little details, vague emblems of majesty. The shield is equally interesting and well struck. So too the legends, although they are only partial, some letters being off-flan because of its shape. The rarely seen mintmark is crisp in detail. At first glance this coin looks like nothing, a crude cobbling of elements. The more you study it, though, the more you realize it's a simply superb example of this emergency coinage, made at one of England's most horrific moments, outbreak of its disastrous Civil War, which when it ended in 1660 brought back a monarchy totally different in power and attitude from that which prevailed in 1643, when this coin was made, almost even then "in memory" of once-mighty kingship. "

I love the quibble about the NGC grading. But even so, Give It A Break!

Would certainly up their SEO if they haven't copied and pasted it from an Encyclopedia, that is! I might list a 1966 penny with a description like that, just for the email responses from bemused collectors worldwide!

"This 1967 penny is the finest we've ever seen - and we've seen many! Almost full iridescent lustre, this coin is virtually in the state it left the Mint in 1969. (Yes, note the historical drama - despite carrying the date 1967, this penny was actually minted in 1969 due to the quirky law passed by Great Britain's Chancellor, Jim Callaghan. This minting of a coin bearing the incorrect date was unprecedented since.. the year before). The generous size of these old pennies puts today's hastily struck minor coins into perspective. Remember - a 1967 penny is the last of its kind, redolent of that lost era between February and August 1971 when - already doomed - it and its peers could be seen gasping out the last weeks of their existence. This particular specimen is 100% guaranteed genuine, having been taken from a receipted Mint Sealed Bag which lay forgotten in the cellar of a 1960s coin dealer who went out of business in 1972. All the other specimens in the bag were damaged by environmental factors, but this miracle specimen emerged virtually unscathed and we offer it - slabbed and annotated - as an artefact of a lost age of coin collecting."

I think I will list one Peck with your exact wording, just for the craic! (with your permission!)

Feel free! (Don't mention me, though )

:lol: I might have a bid myself if it's 100% guaranteed genuine and is indeed a miracle specimen!

[Rob 3,002]

It is just another example of Heritage (and others) pandering to the number assigned by the TPG. Once a coin gets a number above 65 or 66, US buyers will pay way over the odds based on another's numerical opinion. Leave it. Nobody says you have to buy it.

[azda 973]

This sort of BS is what drives me away from American auction houses, talking up coins the way they do, there's really no need for all the schmazzzz ma tazzzz associated with what is a plain 1853 sixpence. HERITAGE, give it a break...................Here is their description of an 1853 sixpence, starting price is a whopping $1000 with an estimate of $2000 See how many metaphors you can pick out. All that's missing from this is a fricking billboard and flashing lights and if it hits the top end it will be 1000 GBP OVER Spinks UNC price guide

Victoria Sixpence 1853, Young Head, S-3908, KM733.1, MS68 PCGS, just splendid, in fact one of the best English silver coins of any type we have seen, with intense luster, super-bold details, flawless surfaces, a flashy snow-white brilliant reverse with a hint of golden iridescent hues, and an obverse sheathed in an exquisite blend of golden blue iridescence. Pristine! From The Kairos Collection

I will admit to having a chuckle when I saw that description. The more so that the close up photo of the coin does not really match the hyperbole. As a sixpence collector, this and other coins in the auction do interest me. But the prices are completely over the top. Which is a shame as I would have been willing to drop a decent number of dollars at prices which more accurately matched what I believe to be the value of the coins. I have bid and won a few times at Heritage in their weekly internet auctions and, usually, the prices are more or less what one would expect. But this particular auction seems to be completely over the top. I don't know if this is due to unrealistic reserves being set by sellers or by an auction house trying to manipulate market prices. It will be interesting to see how much success they have.

You've hit the nail on the head Jaggy, OTT prices coupled with market manipulation. I said it before in a thread a few months back, but Heritage normally start the bidding at Spink book for grade and work upwards from there. Just because a Common 1853 sixpence is a Good UNC does'nt mean i want to pay 3 times over Spinks price guide. Of course, a quality soecimen i would have thought in the £259-£350 range, but over £1300 is a bloody joke if it Hits top estimate, in fact the £650 start price is a joke, thats Double what spink Rate a UNC at , and checking back on Londoncoins previous auctuons, best i can see sold for £160 in 2011 and another in UNC or near so in 2012 for £135

[azda 973]

It is just another example of Heritage (and others) pandering to the number assigned by the TPG. Once a coin gets a number above 65 or 66, US buyers will pay way over the odds based on another's numerical opinion. Leave it. Nobody says you have to buy it.

Not wanting to buy it Rob, its the BS description that comes

With it to Hype the bidders into a frenzy for a Common date coin and then whip in an OTT start and estimate price that really gets on my nipple ends

Edited April 13, 2013 by azda

[Rob 3,002]

It is just another example of Heritage (and others) pandering to the number assigned by the TPG. Once a coin gets a number above 65 or 66, US buyers will pay way over the odds based on another's numerical opinion. Leave it. Nobody says you have to buy it.

Not wanting to buy it Rob, its the BS description that comes

With it to Hype the bidders into a frenzy for a Common date coin and then whio in an OTT start and estimate price

That really gets on my nipple ends

Yes, but that's part and parcel of the estimate. Nobody is going to list a lot described as a decent example and then expect it to sell for multiples of its normal market value. It isn't any different to all those on ebay who extol the virtues of their listings, just that with eBay you are a bit more circumspect knowing who is likely to be the seller. In many US eyes, a 68 is an abnormality that should be pursued - hence the high estimate. It only needs one person to put a bid in at the reserve and it's sold. Many people buy the number just to improve their set ranking.

Edited April 13, 2013 by Rob

[Rob 3,002]

This sort of BS is what drives me away from American auction houses, talking up coins the way they do, there's really no need for all the schmazzzz ma tazzzz associated with what is a plain 1853 sixpence. HERITAGE, give it a break...................Here is their description of an 1853 sixpence, starting price is a whopping $1000 with an estimate of $2000 See how many metaphors you can pick out. All that's missing from this is a fricking billboard and flashing lights and if it hits the top end it will be 1000 GBP OVER Spinks UNC price guide

Victoria Sixpence 1853, Young Head, S-3908, KM733.1, MS68 PCGS, just splendid, in fact one of the best English silver coins of any type we have seen, with intense luster, super-bold details, flawless surfaces, a flashy snow-white brilliant reverse with a hint of golden iridescent hues, and an obverse sheathed in an exquisite blend of golden blue iridescence. Pristine! From The Kairos Collection

I will admit to having a chuckle when I saw that description. The more so that the close up photo of the coin does not really match the hyperbole. As a sixpence collector, this and other coins in the auction do interest me. But the prices are completely over the top. Which is a shame as I would have been willing to drop a decent number of dollars at prices which more accurately matched what I believe to be the value of the coins. I have bid and won a few times at Heritage in their weekly internet auctions and, usually, the prices are more or less what one would expect. But this particular auction seems to be completely over the top. I don't know if this is due to unrealistic reserves being set by sellers or by an auction house trying to manipulate market prices. It will be interesting to see how much success they have.

You've hit the nail on the head Jaggy, OTT prices coupled with market manipulation. I said it before in a thread a few months back, but Heritage normally start the bidding at Spink book for grade and work upwards from there. Just because a Common 1853 sixpence is a Good UNC does'nt mean i want to pay 3 times over Spinks price guide. Of course, a quality soecimen i would have thought in the £259-£350 range, but over £1300 is a bloody joke if it Hits top estimate, in fact the £650 start price is a joke, thats Double what spink Rate a UNC at , and checking back on Londoncoins previous auctuons, best i can see sold for £160 in 2011 and another in UNC or near so in 2012 for £135

That's because 1853 isn't a rare date.

[azda 973]

It is just another example of Heritage (and others) pandering to the number assigned by the TPG. Once a coin gets a number above 65 or 66, US buyers will pay way over the odds based on another's numerical opinion. Leave it. Nobody says you have to buy it.

Not wanting to buy it Rob, its the BS description that comes

With it to Hype the bidders into a frenzy for a Common date coin and then whio in an OTT start and estimate price

That really gets on my nipple ends

Yes, but that's part and parcel of the estimate. Nobody is going to list a lot described as a decent example and then expect it to sell for multiples of its normal market value. It isn't any different to all those on ebay who extol the virtues of their listings, just that with eBay you are a bit more circumspect knowing who is likely to be the seller. In many US eyes, a 68 is an abnormality that should be pursued - hence the high estimate. It only needs one person to put a bid in at the reserve and it's sold. Many people buy the number just to improve their set ranking.

Yes, but 9/10 eBay listings start at a £1 and end up with a possible 3 figure ending

[jaggy 528]

This sort of BS is what drives me away from American auction houses, talking up coins the way they do, there's really no need for all the schmazzzz ma tazzzz associated with what is a plain 1853 sixpence. HERITAGE, give it a break...................Here is their description of an 1853 sixpence, starting price is a whopping $1000 with an estimate of $2000 See how many metaphors you can pick out. All that's missing from this is a fricking billboard and flashing lights and if it hits the top end it will be 1000 GBP OVER Spinks UNC price guide

Victoria Sixpence 1853, Young Head, S-3908, KM733.1, MS68 PCGS, just splendid, in fact one of the best English silver coins of any type we have seen, with intense luster, super-bold details, flawless surfaces, a flashy snow-white brilliant reverse with a hint of golden iridescent hues, and an obverse sheathed in an exquisite blend of golden blue iridescence. Pristine! From The Kairos Collection

I will admit to having a chuckle when I saw that description. The more so that the close up photo of the coin does not really match the hyperbole. As a sixpence collector, this and other coins in the auction do interest me. But the prices are completely over the top. Which is a shame as I would have been willing to drop a decent number of dollars at prices which more accurately matched what I believe to be the value of the coins. I have bid and won a few times at Heritage in their weekly internet auctions and, usually, the prices are more or less what one would expect. But this particular auction seems to be completely over the top. I don't know if this is due to unrealistic reserves being set by sellers or by an auction house trying to manipulate market prices. It will be interesting to see how much success they have.

You've hit the nail on the head Jaggy, OTT prices coupled with market manipulation. I said it before in a thread a few months back, but Heritage normally start the bidding at Spink book for grade and work upwards from there. Just because a Common 1853 sixpence is a Good UNC does'nt mean i want to pay 3 times over Spinks price guide. Of course, a quality soecimen i would have thought in the £259-£350 range, but over £1300 is a bloody joke if it Hits top estimate, in fact the £650 start price is a joke, thats Double what spink Rate a UNC at , and checking back on Londoncoins previous auctuons, best i can see sold for £160 in 2011 and another in UNC or near so in 2012 for £135

I don't have an 1853 sixpence so naturally I was interested. But, as they say, patience is a virtue so I am happy to wait for one that is appropriately priced. I was also quite interested in the 1887 pattern sixpence ( I already have the aluminium one) but, again, the price is way over the top. A similar one sold at London coins for £380 (or $600) in 2009. I might have gone to $750, $800 or even $900 but $1400 which is the Heritage minimum is out of the question.

American collectors may be willing to pay silly prices but I am not. Even though I live in the USA, bidding and buying from the UK is perfectly possible. As I have said elsewhere on this forum, the internet has made this a worldwide market. Heritage should take note.

[VickySilver 775]

I had made a comment on this before: strangely in this "Kairos Collection"- which consisted of essentially all high grade (TPG) pieces - the scarcer bits have many times been relatively underpriced IMO. In the earlier sale, I managed to get an MS66 Small Head 1889 Shilling for under 1000 pounds that by far the nicest I have seen. Also a superb 1862 shilling was priced UNDER such as 1864, etc.

So, whilst in the name of suppressing competition I ought not to report this, I would caution the browser to know their coins and that bargains are still present.

Edited April 13, 2013 by VickySilver

[Gary D 76]

This sort of BS is what drives me away from American auction houses, talking up coins the way they do, there's really no need for all the schmazzzz ma tazzzz associated with what is a plain 1853 sixpence. HERITAGE, give it a break...................Here is their description of an 1853 sixpence, starting price is a whopping $1000 with an estimate of $2000 See how many metaphors you can pick out. All that's missing from this is a fricking billboard and flashing lights and if it hits the top end it will be 1000 GBP OVER Spinks UNC price guide

Victoria Sixpence 1853, Young Head, S-3908, KM733.1, MS68 PCGS, just splendid, in fact one of the best English silver coins of any type we have seen, with intense luster, super-bold details, flawless surfaces, a flashy snow-white brilliant reverse with a hint of golden iridescent hues, and an obverse sheathed in an exquisite blend of golden blue iridescence. Pristine! From The Kairos Collection

I will admit to having a chuckle when I saw that description. The more so that the close up photo of the coin does not really match the hyperbole. As a sixpence collector, this and other coins in the auction do interest me. But the prices are completely over the top. Which is a shame as I would have been willing to drop a decent number of dollars at prices which more accurately matched what I believe to be the value of the coins. I have bid and won a few times at Heritage in their weekly internet auctions and, usually, the prices are more or less what one would expect. But this particular auction seems to be completely over the top. I don't know if this is due to unrealistic reserves being set by sellers or by an auction house trying to manipulate market prices. It will be interesting to see how much success they have.

You've hit the nail on the head Jaggy, OTT prices coupled with market manipulation. I said it before in a thread a few months back, but Heritage normally start the bidding at Spink book for grade and work upwards from there. Just because a Common 1853 sixpence is a Good UNC does'nt mean i want to pay 3 times over Spinks price guide. Of course, a quality soecimen i would have thought in the £259-£350 range, but over £1300 is a bloody joke if it Hits top estimate, in fact the £650 start price is a joke, thats Double what spink Rate a UNC at , and checking back on Londoncoins previous auctuons, best i can see sold for £160 in 2011 and another in UNC or near so in 2012 for £135

I don't have an 1853 sixpence so naturally I was interested. But, as they say, patience is a virtue so I am happy to wait for one that is appropriately priced. I was also quite interested in the 1887 pattern sixpence ( I already have the aluminium one) but, again, the price is way over the top. A similar one sold at London coins for £380 (or $600) in 2009. I might have gone to $750, $800 or even $900 but $1400 which is the Heritage minimum is out of the question.

American collectors may be willing to pay silly prices but I am not. Even though I live in the USA, bidding and buying from the UK is perfectly possible. As I have said elsewhere on this forum, the internet has made this a worldwide market. Heritage should take note.

The problem is that I get the impression that the average American collector will not touch a raw coin with a barge poll so they are willing to pay what to us seem like stupid prices. Mind you that leaves more for us.

[azda 973]

There are also people out there who buy high grade raw coins and send them to Heritage, these people make a decent living from this practise. Judging from some of Heritages eatimates, they're making a killing. There was once talk of a predecimal coin club, buying a raw coin and Shipping to the US of A,, just saying

[Gary D 76]

There are also people out there who buy high grade raw coins and send them to Heritage, these people make a decent living from this practise. Judging from some of Heritages eatimates, they're making a killing. There was once talk of a predecimal coin club, buying a raw coin and Shipping to the US of A,, just saying

I have often thought about getting my PL67 crown re-slabbed and sent of to the likes of Heritage. The problem is the slabbing, to get it put back into it's PCGS slab is very involved and expensive for a one off unless you are a member.

[Rob 3,002]

There are also people out there who buy high grade raw coins and send them to Heritage, these people make a decent living from this practise. Judging from some of Heritages eatimates, they're making a killing. There was once talk of a predecimal coin club, buying a raw coin and Shipping to the US of A,, just saying

I have often thought about getting my PL67 crown re-slabbed and sent of to the likes of Heritage. The problem is the slabbing, to get it put back into it's PCGS slab is very involved and expensive for a one off unless you are a member.

You are also assuming it is going to make a similar grade or attribution as it did previously. I sold a US customer a proof halfpenny (P1235) that had previously graded 64. It came back as a currency strike MS62. Easy money if you can make it with no comeback.