Jump to content
British Coin Forum - Predecimal.com

50 Years of RotographicCoinpublications.com A Rotographic Imprint. Price guide reference book publishers since 1959. Lots of books on coins, banknotes and medals. Please visit and like Coin Publications on Facebook for offers and updates.

Coin Publications on Facebook

   Rotographic    

The current range of books. Click the image above to see them on Amazon (printed and Kindle format). More info on coinpublications.com

predecimal.comPredecimal.com. One of the most popular websites on British pre-decimal coins, with hundreds of coins for sale, advice for beginners and interesting information.

Recommended Posts

Hi everyone, putting aside the golden rules of cleaning coins....

I have acquired two proof half crowns 1935 and 1936. These rare VIP proofs command a price of around £1000 in mint condition, however these have been lightly circulated...

They were both stored in the same pvc flap together for years, and then maybe left to bake in the sun light somehow. The obverse has horrible tack black marks and even a little of the melted plastic residue from the pvc and oils stuck to the surface. What a way to store a VIP proof! Then again the fact they had entered circulation demonstrates the owner probably just thought they were shiny currency issue half crowns.

I’m a trader not collector, what would you do? Clean to enhance the value or sell on in its current form.... also I have no idea how I would clean a proof.

Mat

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hi everyone, putting aside the golden rules of cleaning coins....

I have acquired two proof half crowns 1935 and 1936. These rare VIP proofs command a price of around £1000 in mint condition, however these have been lightly circulated...

They were both stored in the same pvc flap together for years, and then maybe left to bake in the sun light somehow. The obverse has horrible tack black marks and even a little of the melted plastic residue from the pvc and oils stuck to the surface. What a way to store a VIP proof! Then again the fact they had entered circulation demonstrates the owner probably just thought they were shiny currency issue half crowns.

I’m a trader not collector, what would you do? Clean to enhance the value or sell on in its current form.... also I have no idea how I would clean a proof.

Mat

If you clean it you will damage it in any case, so best sell them on as is.

Are you sure they are proofs and not just an early strike? People who own proofs usually know they are a special strike and the chances of them getting into circulation are therefore unlikely given they would only have been current for 35 years from production. Good hi res images would be needed to ascertain whether they are proofs or not as there is more than a polished field required for a proof.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ditto on that one. Send us pictures if you can.

In the meanwhile, going only on what you told us, simple mild dish detergent/soap with hot water would be a good start. Then an acetone bath with these. To tell you more is quite difficult at this stage.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks guys, As Rob says its would seem unlikely they could be proof issues are they are so rare but in all the years I have been doing this I have never come across a currency issue half crown with real mirror images like you have in proof coins, the fields in the design are so proof like I can see my reflection very clear even tough the coin is warn.

If they are not proof issues, they cannot be normal currency issues, surely they are some sort of special strike...

Please excuse the pics.... and the camera

post-4614-1246634145_thumb.jpg

post-4614-1246634196_thumb.jpg

post-4614-1246634205_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks guys, As Rob says its would seem unlikely they could be proof issues are they are so rare but in all the years I have been doing this I have never come across a currency issue half crown with real mirror images like you have in proof coins, the fields in the design are so proof like I can see my reflection very clear even tough the coin is warn.

If they are not proof issues, they cannot be normal currency issues, surely they are some sort of special strike...

Please excuse the pics.... and the camera

The were specimen issues for both those years. They can be proof like on the fields.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks guys, As Rob says its would seem unlikely they could be proof issues are they are so rare but in all the years I have been doing this I have never come across a currency issue half crown with real mirror images like you have in proof coins, the fields in the design are so proof like I can see my reflection very clear even tough the coin is warn.

If they are not proof issues, they cannot be normal currency issues, surely they are some sort of special strike...

Please excuse the pics.... and the camera

The crucial thing to look at to determine proofs is the edges of the rim : on proofs they will be sharp. It will be a little difficult here as they have had either some circulation or some frequent handling, but they should still be even, regular and fairly crisp. However, the same would be true of specimen strikings, and as these are a long way from FDC it may never be possible to tell the difference.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks guys, As Rob says its would seem unlikely they could be proof issues are they are so rare but in all the years I have been doing this I have never come across a currency issue half crown with real mirror images like you have in proof coins, the fields in the design are so proof like I can see my reflection very clear even tough the coin is warn.

If they are not proof issues, they cannot be normal currency issues, surely they are some sort of special strike...

Please excuse the pics.... and the camera

The crucial thing to look at to determine proofs is the edges of the rim : on proofs they will be sharp. It will be a little difficult here as they have had either some circulation or some frequent handling, but they should still be even, regular and fairly crisp. However, the same would be true of specimen strikings, and as these are a long way from FDC it may never be possible to tell the difference.

The edges are very sharp, both on the rim and edge serations, would you know if the known proof specimens are plain edges??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The edges are very sharp, both on the rim and edge serations, would you know if the known proof specimens are plain edges??

I don't - I've never seen a proof or a specimen for that series, apart from the 1935 'raised edge proof' crown. But the very sharp edges are a good sign. An early strike wouldn't give that in my opinion. It's not definitive of course.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The edges are very sharp, both on the rim and edge serations, would you know if the known proof specimens are plain edges??

I don't - I've never seen a proof or a specimen for that series, apart from the 1935 'raised edge proof' crown. But the very sharp edges are a good sign. An early strike wouldn't give that in my opinion. It's not definitive of course.

I have a 1935 specimen which is in its red box similar to the specimen/proof crown. I also have what I assume to be an early strike. They are practically indistinguishable although perhaps in the area of the rim the edge of the rim to the beads is a bit sharper.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just my two pennuth (no pun intended). I never ever clean any coins, as the risk of either partial or complete ruination is too great. I have occasionally wiped obvious excess off coin surfaces, with a damp new duster.

The only coin I ever tried to clean was an 1881H halfpenny, which I bought at an auction. It looked pretty much dark finish UNC, but had some weird gunk stuck between the lettering on the obverse. Unfortunately, cleaning in warm soapy water failed to remove the gunk, but did leave some mottle like staining on the rest of the coin. So I've steered well clear ever since, working on the assumption that you are very fortunate indeed to find coins of that ilk, in perfect condition.

Many of them in nr UNC condition, may well have lain in the same spot for decades on end, before discovery, and have picked up whatever they were next to, be it grease, oil or other debris.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have always been disappointed with the absolutes that we see thrown about in descriptions of proofs. I think there are tendencies and some characteristics more in line with proof status. I also have come to be of the opinion that the Royal Mint was not always that careful with dies or planchets and so we get polished die pieces, and coins that appear superior to the usual circulation strikes but not quite proof and designate them "specimen" and what may have been employment of proof dies in striking circulation strikes. Proofs from the George V series beginning in about 1922 or so (depends on who is counting what) were many times not stellar and not always clearly superior to the best first strikes off the dies.

Of course the Wreaths are perhaps best known for very nice currency strikes with a few being quite prooflike and some appearing to reach what seemed to be proof quality at the time. I have seen a few certified/slabbed as proof that I am fairly certain are not despite relatively squared sharp edges and crisp milling.

Somewhat analagous to the Victorian currency/Maundy 3d discrimination and in requiring definite status as currency before being accepted as such, I think a particular coin can not be considered proof unless it meets all of the general criteria. These are interesting but from the photos and despite their impaired status, I do not think can be accepted as proof and could not buy or sell them as such.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×